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#21 of 604 by sphinx99 Nov 22, 2003 (6:13 pm)
I think you're understating the torque difference... been following s2ki quite a bit lately and nearly everyone appears to feel the difference. The '04 felt quicker than my fully-broken-in '02, which bodes well. I feel a substantial difference.   In terms of times based on s2ki and vtec.net, the 2.2L seems to match up almost identically to the '00-'03; it gets to speed faster, but loses back that time by having to shift sooner due to the lower redline.   I have a '04 for the weekend (Suzuka blue - my saleswoman has a "demo" and loaned it to me so long as I promised not to destroy it!) so I've put a lot of seat time into one today. The biggest difference I'm finding is that the larger motor does not need to work nearly as hard to make the same power; hence, cabin noise levels are markedly lower, particularly with the top up. With the top up, the '04 is quieter than my old '80s Prelude coupe was... which is a huge step towards making the S a more palatable daily driver.   I was disappointed that the HIDs still aren't self-leveling... really the only "feature" I'd like to see added at this point. JDM models allegedly get nav, although for the life of me I wouldn't know where the screen could be mounted.   The '04 is still relatively new so I don't anticipate taking it past 6k RPM during my brief stay with it, so I can't speak to the VTEC transition. I understand from others that it is much less pronounced.
#22 of 604 More 2004 by sphinx99 Nov 23, 2003 (3:55 pm)
Before I hand in the keys in the morning... *cry*   I'm really, really wowed by the change in NVH, particularly with the top up. Between the lower sound levels and the more point-and-shoot engine power, I'm finding my mouth watering for the S once again. Suzuka Blue Metallic is a lovely color, moreover, although I don't know how I feel about the blue interior.   I saw some pictures of Japan-market S2000s which feature Sebring and Silverstone silvers with the blue leather seating... looked very sharp. I wonder why we can't get that here!   Also, I definitely like the RE050s better. I did a few mid-RPM launches, both straight and turns, and find the tires to be far, far better. They stick tight, and when they do lose traction it's a quiet slip - like softly rubbing a sneaker on some loose gravel and sand, not a squeal at all. I also sense that they are quieter than the S02s. A combination of the tweaked suspension and lower profile tires somehow maintains or improves road feedback while dialing out the harshness on the really big potholes.
#23 of 604 What is the 2004 S2000 Going For? by carliker Nov 25, 2003 (12:00 pm)
I'm in the market for an 2004 S2000 after returning the 2004 RX-8. The guy at the closest dealership to me (in Indiana) says he'll give me $500.00 of MSRP. No more. I was figuring that they could do a bit better since we are headed for winter. Is this a reasonable discount on a convertible?   On another note, I always find it a waste of time when people who have an older model of a car state the new one isn't much of an improvement over the 2 or 3 year old one they have. It's almost like they have to rationalize to themselves that their car is still cool. The 2004 may not be a leap over the previous S2000 models, but it sure is an improvement worth reconizing. It's still not an easy car to live with day in and day out, but the improvement that has been made with the 2004 IS significant.
#24 of 604 by sphinx99 Nov 25, 2003 (1:25 pm)
I'd go for $1k under sticker - just say that's your offer and you'll sign the dotted line right then and there if they agree to the price. Dealer makes good profit on the vehicle, even at $1k below sticker, and the '04 is newer and better but it's not that much newer and better so as to reset the entire dynamic.   That said, a dealer near me has a new '03 that they're willing to deal on for numbers closer to invoice than MSRP. I think '03s are going to become an even better bargain than they are now.
#25 of 604 carliker by geepers Nov 25, 2003 (8:54 pm)
Sorry to waste your time, but I stand by my statement that the '04 as a daily driver is not that much of an improvement over past years, in terms of a daily driver. Slightly softened ride, maybe, slightly more torque. By it's very nature, the S2000 will never be a good daily driver for most people. How many people even want to be bothered with checking the oil every fillup?
#26 of 604 by habitat1 Nov 26, 2003 (3:37 am)
I've been given a 2004 S2000 to drive for the next 3 days while the Honda general manager is out for the Thanksgiving holiday. I know the owners of the dealership and they still joke that it's their goal to get me to drop my spot (#2) on the Elise list and get an S2000 instead. Something about someone my age shouldn't be trying to get in and out of an Elise.   I've only had the S2000 for 20 miles, but for all this debate over a "substantial" improvement, I don't see it yet. Nor do I think one was needed. As someone else mentioned, if you want a torquey, lower RPM car, just get a Boxster S or Z4 and leave the S2000 to those who like to shift.   The next few days will allow me a fairer comparison. Fortunately, the car already has 2,000 miles on it, so I won't be afraid to rev it up. I might even get my neighbor with a 2002 to sneak out for a little "competition", at our local private airstrip.
#27 of 604 sphinx by blacktalon Nov 28, 2003 (3:54 pm)
I'd say go for the 2004 S2K. Then you can let me know how it works out as a daily driver in the snow belt...
#28 of 604 by sphinx99 Nov 29, 2003 (8:35 am)
Here is the unadulterated bad news: I did!   This sadly came with the condition (from my better half) that this would be my last present to myself for the remainder of the decade Now she controls the cash and the gifts!   I like the car - those with several cars may be less impressed (they even may find it a step backwards due to the tamed redline) but if this is a daily driver then it's a step forward in my opinion. This is for a few reasons,   1. Cabin noise definitely is lower. I think it's due to lower revs to maintain speed. My brand new, not-even-broken in '04 does 70mph around 3500rpm, which is noticably lower than the '02 did. I also think the RE050 tires are quieter than the S02s at speed.   2. The stereo still sucks, but it sucks less!   3. Suspension - my ride to work has some pretty bad stretches which were just horrific on the previous S. The new one seems more composed - you still feel the road, just not all the way to your dental fillings.   4. The tires - I like 'em. As you know we've had a lot of rain and snow over the last few days. The RE050s cut through the rain like I wouldn't believe - I was very impressed. On damp road they are stellar. On standing water, uh, less so. I haven't had a chance to test out snow; the flurries we're getting haven't collected. The impression I get is that they will be awful - the tires are described as not recommended for snow by Tirerack. Thinking about getting a single pair of Blizzaks just for the rears.   There aren't too many drawbacks to the latest version of the S, although two come to mind.   One is the redline. 9000rpm was as high as you could get in a production car--beyond Ferrari, beyond Porsche, beyond BMW. 8000rpm remains high but it's a bit less dramatic. I guess it's the loss of a bit of flair. Day to day things seem a little spunkier, esp. in the midrange, but I've read that the '04 is pretty much in a dead heat with the '00-'03 on autocrosses b/c what's gained in torque and hp is lost through shifts that come sooner.   Two, the old S had pretty ordinary, regular wheels - typical of your standard, oh, family sedan. The new S's rubber is much lower profile (245/40/17s) and has a strong aftermarket flair which makes me worry more about (a) cracking rims on potholes and (b) theft and/or attracting the wrong kind of people.   Overall, I'd say the car is livable for dry and rain, wet or cold, short or long trips. Snow? Good question - I'll find out soon.
#29 of 604 by blacktalon Nov 29, 2003 (2:50 pm)
Congrats, sphinx!   I'm thinking you might want to go with four winter tires instead of just two, though...
#30 of 604 by sphinx99 Nov 29, 2003 (7:30 pm)
Well, what I found in the past (with the '02 as well as now with the '04) is that the rear tends to be the one that cause the most problems in inclement weather. I wish I could speak to the '04 more intelligently but we haven't had any snow, however should it behave the same, then switching the rears certainly would be much less expensive than switching both. 245/40/17 winter tires are more expensive than I would have thought!   Or, I never take vacation and have weeks upon weeks that I simply could burn up whenever the white stuff falls. Hmm.

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