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What about fuel types & gas mileage?

281 messages,  Last post on Sep 22, 2009 at 3:52 PM

You are in the Maintenance & Repair Forum. Your Host is mr_shiftright

What is this discussion about? Engine, Fuel System


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#221 of 281
Re: in cars designed for 91 max, does 92,93,94 help anything? [Mr_Shiftrigh [elias] by Mr_Shiftright HOST
May 09, 2006 (12:26 pm)
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Replying to: elias (May 09, 2006 12:23 pm)

that's a good point, never thought of that.
 
I guess what I was driving at is the common misconception that premium fuel is some kind of "doggie treat" for your car
#222 of 281
Re: in cars designed for 91 max, does 92,93,94 help anything? [Mr_Shiftright] by shipo
May 09, 2006 (12:27 pm)
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (May 09, 2006 12:18 pm)

"It's my present understanding that using 91 octane in a car designed expressly for 87 octane is pretty much a waste of money..."
 
Absolutely, positively no argument from me. I thought we were discussing the GTO which per a recent post requires 91 octane or greater, not a car that carries a recommendation of 87.
 
With your comments in mind, I'm thinking that in theory at least, it is possible to design a normally aspirated engine specifically for 87 octane, and then design the ignition system to be able to nominally take advantage of a higher octane fuel. That having been said, in reality my bet is that advancing the timing on such a car far enough to take advantage of fuels beyond say 89 octane is probably not going to happen.
 
Best Regards,
Shipo
#223 of 281
Re: in cars designed for 91 max, does 92,93,94 help anything? [shipo] by Mr_Shiftright HOST
May 09, 2006 (12:27 pm)
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Replying to: shipo (May 09, 2006 12:27 pm)

I'll be sure, on my next long trip, to run a full tank of premium on the same highway at the same speeds and see what happens, if anything.
#224 of 281
Re: in cars designed for 91 max, does 92,93,94 help anything? [Mr_Shiftright] by shipo
May 09, 2006 (12:29 pm)
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (May 09, 2006 12:27 pm)

Which car in your stable are we talking about here, a Honda or a Porsche?
 
Best Regards,
Shipo
#225 of 281
Re: in cars designed for 91 max, does 92,93,94 help anything? [shipo] by Mr_Shiftright HOST
May 09, 2006 (12:31 pm)
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Replying to: shipo (May 09, 2006 12:29 pm)

the little Scion xA commuter car. The Porsche V-8 runs very happily on 87 octane BTW. Funny, but the only cars I ever owned that would not run on 87 octane without horrible protests were Volvos.
#226 of 281
Re: in cars designed for 91 max, does 92,93,94 help anything? [Mr_Shiftright] by shipo
May 09, 2006 (12:59 pm)
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (May 09, 2006 12:31 pm)

I'm not at all well versed in "Scionese", however, I have heard the stray report claiming that some Toyota engines are capable of advancing their ignition timing to a certain extent. Far enough to efficiently consume Premium? Probably not. Midgrade? Depending upon how the engine is built, that is at least theoretically possible.
 
Best Regards,
Shipo
#227 of 281
adaptive transmissions... by explorerx4
May 09, 2006 (5:19 pm)
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a lot of modern engines and transmissions adapt to 'your driving style'.
my pzev focus has a manual transmission, no tach, and an upshift light(flashback to the 80's).
one time i filled up with 93 octane. got my worst mileage ever, 24.9 average for the tank, and the upshift light never came on. for the life of the car i have averaged 28.9 mpg.
my explorer seems to run quieter on high test, but the mileage in not necessarily better, except when using winter gas in a cold snap.
#228 of 281
Re: adaptive transmissions... [explorerx4] by shipo
May 09, 2006 (5:36 pm)
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Replying to: explorerx4 (May 09, 2006 5:19 pm)

As a general rule, the gasoline that a car was designed for (and what is specified in the manual) is the fuel that will allow any given engine to deliver both the best mileage and the best power.
 
In the case of the Focus, there is no surprise that your mileage went into the dumper, Premium fuel simply isn't volatile enough for that engine.
 
As for your Explorer, unless your engine is heavily carboned up on the inside of the combustion chambers, Premium gasoline shouldn’t make it run smoother at all. In fact, due to the effectively cooler burn that results from high octane fuel and a low compression engine, all you are doing is accelerating the process of carboning up the combustion chambers. Once enough carbon builds up, then "Hot Spots" can occur, and when they do, then you really will need Premium just to keep the engine from running in a constant state of detonation.
 
Best Regards,
Shipo
#229 of 281
Re: adaptive transmissions... [shipo] by explorerx4
May 09, 2006 (6:21 pm)
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Replying to: shipo (May 09, 2006 5:36 pm)

i think you explained what happened with the focus and i am not going to put it to the test again. regular is just fine.
with the explorer v8/auto/towing pkg, it seems like the transmission got out of sync with the change in the operaion of the engine. back to regular gas, everything is as was before.
what do you think about switching brands of gas because they have different formulations?
#230 of 281
Re: adaptive transmissions... [explorerx4] by shipo
May 09, 2006 (7:38 pm)
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Replying to: explorerx4 (May 09, 2006 6:21 pm)

While I've never been particularly brand loyal as far as my gasoline is concerned, I have always tryed to stay with the name brand gasolines if for no other reason than they seem to have a higher turn over rate than the smaller Brand X stations. As modern gasoline ages (and unlike wine, aging gasoline ain't for the best), it becomes less stable (as I understand it, I've never researched this aspect of gasoline), and as such less efficient.
 
Regarding different formulations, logistically speaking I just don't see how one brand can actually sell different gasoline than the next due to refining and transportation issues as well as various efforts at standardization such as the "Top-Tier" gasoline program.
 
I'm sure this wasn't much help but there you have it. :-/
 
Best Regards,
Shipo

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