Last post on Nov 22, 2013 at 6:14 PM
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MINI Cooper, MINI Cooper Clubman, MINI Cooper Countryman, Coupe, Hatchback, SUV
#596 of 1499 Re: which year for used purchase [alexstjo]
Apr 11, 2007 (10:42 am)
best to stay away from the 2002, in my opinion, as things were still getting worked out and there were some problems. Also probably the 2003s. I would look at 2004s to 2006s. The 2007 is a new production (and engine) so again, there may be some initial problems.
The 2006 would be your best bet as that was when most problems had been worked out, but finding a used one might be tough. You can check the cars for sales area here or on North American Motoring. Although there might be discounts on 2006s that dealers still have on the lot and are trying to clear... although the discounts won't be much. Also, I think it would probably be best to stay way from the Cooper CVT (automatic) as I've read they have had a lot of problems. The 2007 doesn't use the CVT anymore from what I understand.
#597 of 1499 Re: which year for used purchase [alexstjo]
Apr 12, 2007 (6:09 am)
I'd definitely stay away from the CVT. If you're after an automatic, the 2007 is the way to go.
If you're after a used Mini Cooper or S stick, you'll want a 2005 or 2006 if you go used--all the bugs are worked out of these, this is also when the gear ratios were changed; it significantly improved the drivability of the car. You may still find one under warranty.
Personally, I'd wait until 2008 at the earliest on the new Mini's--the 2007 is entirely new--every body panel, mechanical part, etc. And there have been some significant problems--not unexpected--given that the 2007 is a completely different car from the 2006. The only thing that is remotely the same is the look.
#598 of 1499 Re: Installation on accessories? [kali4nia]
Apr 12, 2007 (10:35 pm)
youre in california right? which dealers did you visit and who did you get that final deal from?
#599 of 1499 Re: which year for used purchase [cct1]
Apr 13, 2007 (8:34 am)
what are the issues with the CVT? I am planning on purchaseing a automatic (wife can't do a stick!)
#600 of 1499 Re: which year for used purchase [alexstjo]
Apr 14, 2007 (6:22 am)
First of all, there have been many transmission problems with the CVT. The other issue with the CVT is its a dog--its absolutely awful! It takes the Mini, which is otherwise a quick, spry car and makes it so sluggish that it loses much of the fun of driving it. In my opinion, its actually a bit dangerous--it accelerates so slowly, its really a bit dangerous trying to accelerate uphill on a busy road with a fairly high speed limit. I have had a CVT for a day on two seperate occasions (as a loaner), and as much as I love the Mini, the CVT is pretty much looks without the performance.
This is part of the reason that Mini did away with the CVT on the 2007's--so although for the Mini S, I prefer the 2006, if I was getting an automatic base Cooper, I'd definitely, beyond a doubt, get a 2007. The 2007 is a traditional automatic, hopefully will have less issues with the transmission than the CVT, and performs significantly better than the CVT. Also, from a deprecitation standpoint, I think the CVT will be very, very difficult to sell in a few years; the new automatic on the other hand should depreciate very, very slowly in comparison.
#601 of 1499 Re: Installation on accessories? [silentmac]
Apr 15, 2007 (6:48 pm)
Thanks for all the replies on my questions. My girlfriend just ordered her Mini from South BMW in Miami. We emailed all the sales managers in the state and got the lowest price from them. Here is what she ended up ordering:
White Bonnet Stripes
Front Fog Lamps
16" Bridge-Spoke w/ All Season Tires
Punch Leather: Carbon Black
Leather Sport Wheel w/Multifunction
10-Speaker. Hi-Fi Sound System
The sale price for this before taxes and title was $22,185 including the iPod adaptor. We ended up saving over $1000 because the dealer removed the $499 dealer fee, and didn't charge the $650 destination fee. He also threw in free mats and only charged $385 on the iPod adaptor, which is really low compared to some other dealers. Also, most other dealers have a $1000 deposit and this one only charged a $500 deposit.
We live in Tampa and our local dealer in Palm Harbor has been calling for weeks since we did a test drive. When we told him that we were going to order from another dealer because they were so much less expensive, he made sure to tell us that they wouldn't be able to offer us a loaner car if we get the car serviced there. I'm not sure if this was supposed to earn our business but we made it pretty clear that all he had to do was match the price in Miami and we would order from him. Even with the discounts and freebees the Miami dealer still made a handy profit on our sale. I just don't get why the local dealer wouldn't budge. Oh well, we are very excited to drive back down for the delivery. It should be fun to motor over to South Beach for a Mojito when it comes in! For anyone looking to buy a Mini who doesn't mind driving a little, I highly recommend emailing all the dealers around you as we found a large variation in the prices we were quoted. Also, when negotiating don't be afraid to let them know that you are willing to go to another dealer. Some won't budge but some will. Good luck and happy motoring!
#602 of 1499 Re: Installation on accessories? [silentmac]
Apr 15, 2007 (8:14 pm)
thanks for this interesting info.
I'm curious though, I thought all the MINIs were supposed to offer basically the same prices since the options all are established prices...so what is that the Miami dealer just knocked off the stuff you listed above, or did you find a wide variation with all dealers?
I found a place here in NY that is doing a 1 year lease and I think I"m going to do that but I'm not sure that I can get any other places to offer that, although I guess it's worth a try.
did you figure out all your options that you wanted first and then email that list to each dealer?
what is the deposit for if you're buying it?
I've called several mini dealers and always find that the sales people never call me again--which seems odd becuase when I was going to buy my mother a Ford and a Staurn a few years ago I was bombarded with these guys pestering me. So it's interesing that you had the Palm Harbor dealer calling you...
#603 of 1499 Re: Installation on accessories? [tica]
Apr 15, 2007 (9:27 pm)
I looked up all the sales managers in FL and emailed them a list of the options we wanted without prices and asked for their lowest and final "out the door" price. Most of the responses had different prices. The lowest was the one we bought from who gave us MSRP with no additional fees or costs besides taxes and title transfer. This is really below MSRP though because he didn't charge the $650 destination fee which is usually required. I'm really not sure why he didn't other than to get the sale.
Dealer fees, destination fees, and installation on dealer add-ons can add up quick. Any dealer add-ons like the iPod adaptor have a wide degree of latitude on pricing because they charge varying installation rates. There were some dealers that charged alot more for installation and just about everyone's dealer fees were different. (Anywhere from $350-$650).
They certainly have room to drop the price if they want to but most won't. At MSRP, the car we bought yielded them approx. $2100 profit (maybe a little less if they have to pay that destination fee), but they might have made even more because I don't even know whether there are dealer kickbacks.
Paying MSRP seems to be the Mini way, but I did some research and found out that the dealer fees are a price gouge that dealers get away with. It is supposed to pay for the cost to inspect, unwrap, clean, and fuel your car. Of course, these costs really only amount to $100 at most to the dealer and really not even that since they have to do this to any car they get anyway.
Another thing to look out for is the "paint protectant". The Palm Harbor dealer proudly told us that all the cars on the lot have the some sort of paint guard (a large invisible clear decal across the front bumper and hood) and that this was an extra $1000. If you really want this, you can get it installed for much less after market.
The deposit is when you order one. You have to put something down while it is being built. The price is set once you sign the contract and you pay the balance when the car gets in. It really doesn't matter to me what they charge but it's nice having as little of our cashflow tied up as possible. We only ordered because my girlfriend really wanted Oxygen Blue, which nobody has on the lot yet.
Several dealers tried to get us to drop the iPod adaptor because the car already has an aux-in in the glovebox and their installation rate was way too high. We wanted the iPod specific adaptor though because you can control it with the stereo controls on the steering wheel, it charges the iPod, and shows track information on the head unit. We use our iPods for music in our cars now but our adaptor only allows us to use the iPod interface to change songs. It is really dangerous to reach into the glovebox, get your iPod out, and look for a song while you are driving down the freeway. It is certainly worth $385 IMO to have a 1000-20,000 song jukebox in your glovebox that can be controlled with your steering wheel and can be taken with you. Especially, if you already have an iPod. It isn't worth the $700 some other dealers where trying to charge though...
Apr 15, 2007 (10:05 pm)
I second this. A properly made CVT like in the Altima, will cost less to fix and out-everything a traditional automatic. But BMW can't seem to make a decent working one to save its life. That, and CVTs require loads of low-end torque to hook up off the line. That means a 3 - 5L engine in a typical car, plus an engine tuned to low-end RPMs. GM's new 3.6VVT in the LaCrosse and CTS would be a good candidate. The Mini's tiny engine... yeah, it's apallingly slow.
The skinny is that the Mini should only be offered in manual. It's exactly like buying an automatic Porsche. Such a drastic difference in how it drives that you really should just stop being a lame couch potato who complains about everything and just learn to drive stick. Especially with the base Mini, which is pretty underpowered as it is. Two totally different experiences.
And, yes, anyone can learn stick. ANYONE. 90%+ of the entire world drives or can drive a manual transmission. I'm sure if you got a brand new Mini with stick for free, you would figure uit out pretty soon
#605 of 1499 Re: this might be a dumb question--but what do mud flaps do? [blueguydotcom]
Apr 16, 2007 (5:13 am)
what do mudflaps do exactly? And if you are just driving on streets, do you need them?