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Subaru Forester Prices Paid and Buying Experience

2755 messages,  Last post on Dec 01, 2009 at 5:41 PM

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#359 of 2755 Re: Not to criticize, but... [mfletouva #355] by alyosha73 Jul 01, 2004 (11:29 am)
Replying to: mfletouva (Jul 01, 2004 8:26 am) Well, I'll be suspicious of that statement, I suppose it is possible that you got a good deal elsewhere, but for all practical purposes you experience is probably very rare. From my experience, the dealer negotiates only within their margin. Once he reaches his minimum profit, he has to let you walk out, but cant go any lower. That price is a summ of price paid to manufacturer, overhead, and his commission. The fact is that fitzmall has very low overhead, and is willing to keep their sales high by sharing their incentives. So in fact if you were able to get lower price on your car than from Fitzmal, you either got raped on trade-in, financing, extended warranty, processing fees, advertizing fees, delaer installed options, dealer prep fee, etching, gap, debt cancellation, or you are comparing the price of the wrong model/options. Dont mean this as an offense, just experience from my car shopping. Replies to this message: edunnett (Jul 01, 2004 1:55 pm)
#360 of 2755 by ateixeira Jul 01, 2004 (11:46 am)
Not necessarily, a dealer might break even or even lose a tiny bit on one car just to meet a sales quota or internal goal. Won't happen often, though.   -juice
#361 of 2755 Re: Not to criticize, but... [alyosha73 #359] by edunnett Jul 01, 2004 (1:55 pm)
Replying to: alyosha73 (Jul 01, 2004 11:29 am) My dealer recently offered us a NEW 2003 Baja for $19,999 - it MSRP'd for $25K and change. There were no incentives that I could find via edmunds or consumer reports. The dealer holdback was LONG since spent since it sat on the lot for a full year! My guess is they accepted that they were going to take a big loss on getting rid of that car, but it didn't sell at any higher prices - what were they to do?
#362 of 2755 with all due respect - that was Baja by alyosha73 Jul 01, 2004 (9:52 pm)
not a very hot car to start with. I researched those at first, but after one test drive realized that I didnt like it - comfort, space, back seats, handling. However back to my thesis. The car must have been on the lot for more than a year, possibly 2 years ( you have to request an invoice to see the delivery date). At some point Subaru issued additional incentive - dealer cash- you wont be able to find it anywhere, but this is the only reason prices can go lower than invoice minus holdback minus rebate. Granted the final price is low, personally, I noticed with Bajas, that they didnt discount it low enough to justify buying 2003 car in 2005 model year. As a matter of fact as far as march this year I saw those on ebay from texas dealer, for almost the price it would cost to get 2004. They were just waiting and fishing for an uninformed buyer. Also, verify real invoice price, until you see with your own eyes, how much under invoice, dont trust any of the MSRP talk, MSRP could have been quoted of the 2004 car, which was a little higher than for the 2003, I am just guessing, of cause, just be on lookout for dirty tricks. Replies to this message: edunnett (Jul 02, 2004 8:43 am)
#363 of 2755 Re: with all due respect - that was Baja [alyosha73 #362] by edunnett Jul 02, 2004 (8:43 am)
Replying to: alyosha73 (Jul 01, 2004 9:52 pm) Yeah, those poor Bajas/Brats... interesting idea, thought maybe their time had finally come... Guess not. Even Consumer Reports bashed them saying the predicted reliability was below average: "uncharacteristic for a Subaru".
#364 of 2755 Well... by mfletouva Jul 02, 2004 (11:33 am)
No, actually on my Malibu I paid zero doc fees, had no trade in and financed through my own credit union!   My parents did finance their Subie with the dealer, but it was a 2.9/60 month, I don't think that qualifies as being raped. No extended warranty, no trade.   And on both these transactions, we also bought from people that were not paid on commissions, via the internet. In fact on the Malibu, I simply got an email that was the right price, made a phone call and that was that.   I bought from one of the oldest GM dealers in the nation, but from a guy who know my car even better than I did, which was shocking to me since I spent many hours researching it and drove a bunch of them.   I'm not saying my experience is typical, but frankly with traditional dealers beefing up their internet sales its getting more and more common. Many traditional dealers employ someone who is paid a flat fee to deal with their internet customers.   Again, Fitz is fine, but they simply aren't the cheapest. I agree that there is a limit to how low a dealer can go, but Fitz does not go lower than anyone else, and in some cases higher. I mean, how do you explain Fitz pricing a car at $300 over invoice when I can buy the same car on the same day for $700 under? And at the same time, Fitz is saying that's their lowest price. Ok, that's fine, but that wasn't the lowest price from somebody else.   Also, why is their overhead lower than anyone elses? In fact, I see ads for them, big money tv and radio, as much as I do the others and sometimes even more. The guy I bought my car from told him that they're easy to beat, I believe him. His question was, if they say they are giving your their lowest price, but they change it every couple 2 weeks, how are they actually giving you their lowest price?   Look I'm sure Fitz is a fine place, honest, trustworthy, and hassle-free, which is very important to some people. But if your goal is to buy a car for the best price, I don't think that's your best bet most of the time. I'm not telling people not to buy there, I'm just saying that from the sounds of it on here people shop there and nowhere else and just assume they've gotten the best price. Replies to this message: p0926 (Jul 02, 2004 6:45 pm)
#365 of 2755 Re: Well... [mfletouva #364] by p0926 Jul 02, 2004 (6:45 pm)
Replying to: mfletouva (Jul 02, 2004 11:33 am) Matt- Naturally Fitz isn't always going to be the lowest but because they're up front with their pricing and even post it on the Internet I've found them to be an excellent source for determining a target price to pay. And I do think for many folks that Fitz will have the best price. First because unless you're really into haggling it's often hard to get another dealer to go below their price, and second, because they deal in such volume, they can afford to sell cars at a lower profit (FYI: that same sales volume is why they can afford all those ads you see and hear).   -Frank
#366 of 2755 Yes... by mfletouva Jul 06, 2004 (12:02 pm)
I agree with you, that's an accurate picture. A good place to get a picture, perhaps the best price for people who don't want to haggle. But in many instances, not the absolute lowest price. Replies to this message: alyosha73 (Jul 06, 2004 3:46 pm)
#367 of 2755 Re: Yes... [mfletouva #366] by alyosha73 Jul 06, 2004 (3:46 pm)
Replying to: mfletouva (Jul 06, 2004 12:02 pm) Ok, lets leave it at that, for me Fitz was the absolute lowest price I could find on Subie FTX PP, and I tried four other dealers in three states. I spent hours in each dealership, went through al of the tricks - and still had to walk out since they could not even get close within $500 of Fitzmall price. Maybe I just look stupid and they thought that I'll finally pay up. It took a phone call to Fitz to verify the price and leave deposit, I was in DC on business when I finalized the purchase. When I mentioned dealer tricks, they were- (stopped to ask for price, they offered a test drive, I drove and said that I am going to wait untill price drops with release of 2005, they said they can give me a better price, just come on in, so I walk in, they write in big letters MSRP, I dont say a word, they substract 1500 of MSRP, I dont say a word, they ask if I like the price, I say - no, I can do better than that somewhere else, at the time 100 under invoice at Fitzmall, they leave to talk to manager, mentioning that they are working hard for me to put me in the car tonight, they come back with 500 over invoice, I say no, they invite the manager, who starts talking that its not the price of the car but its value which I should look for, I say no, he talks about my family and my wife, mentions that I must not love my wife if I dont want buy such a safe vehicle for my family, thats where I say, enough, whats your final price he drops to 400 over invoice, and keeps talking about paying commissions, keeping lights in the dealership, feeding kids and putting them through college, at which moment I say no, and get up. He says - take the car for a weekend and see if you like it, I have to pry their hands off of me and leave, they stick a bunch of business cards in my pockets, and then call for 3 days, but dont drop the price. This repeats in 3 dealerships with small variations.) So theoretically it is possible that you can get a better deal somewhere else, practically for me it wasnt. As for Fitzmall discounting every month, I dont know what incentives are there, but I only saw the price drop when incentives increased, FWIW other dealers dont immediately share those incentives, so in my experience they are worse. I wont be surprised that my next subie comes from Fitz and I'll save my time huggling with dodgy dealers.
#368 of 2755 by ateixeira Jul 07, 2004 (8:59 am)
CR rated the Baja well overall, actually. It ranked higher than the Honda CR-V, for instance. It did poorly in reliability (specifically).   Some people like to haggle, lots do actually. But I saw an investigative report where men were given lower bottom-line prices than women, for instance. It would also depend on the negotiating skills of the individual.   From my (relatively little) experience, I just kept finding surprises every time I'd buy a car. Sure, price was great, then they'd tack on some other fee or try to add freight a 2nd time. Plus there was pressure to buy on the spot.   YMMV.   -juice

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