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Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Acura TL Prices Paid and Buying Experience
10989 messages, Last post on Dec 04, 2009 at 2:03 PM
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ok Robert..using YOUR numbers and my 8.75% tax rate... $476/month + 8.75% tax = monthly payment of $517.65. Over the course of 36 months, that would cost me a total of----- $18,635. If I BUY a 2008 CPO TL w/nav or a Type S and get it for around $28000, and I finance over 72 months, at 5.5% - the total amount i pay over the life of the loan, will be about $35,760. asssuming ZERO down payment, the monthly is about $504. just baout the same as the cost of a lease of an 09 TL w/tech. If you try to equate the 3 yr lease to the cost of a 6 yr loan, I just double the cost of the 36 months lease, as if I leased TWO cars back to back - which would be 72 months. the lease costs doubled are $37,270. $37,270 - $35,760 = $1510. so basically, if you only consider the costs over the first 6 years, the lease only costs an extra $1500. spread across teh 6 years, that only $251/year, or $20/month. When the comparison is between an 08 and 09 - the $20/month is totally worth it. Here is where the buy vs lease gets tricky. When you lease - you turn the car back in and it's gone. you have nothing left. If I buy the 08, after 72 months, I own the car and it has some value. albeit, in 72 months from now, a CPO 2008 TL will not be worth a ton, but it will be worth something, and given that I will drive about 12-15k/year, and assumign I buy a car with 15k miles on the odometer - at the end of my loan the car iwll have roughly a max of 100k miles or so. that will be in year 2015. So what will a 2008 TL with 100k miles be worth in 2015??? my guess..anywhere from $5-10k. if you assume that in 2015, a 2008 TL will be about 8 model years old...then one big question is to assess what that car will be worth 6 years down the road, when my loan is paid off. to truly compare a lease to buy you have to factor in that at the end of the lease you won NOTHING and at the end of a purchase you OWN the car and unless you destroy the car and it implodes - that car has a net VALUE. you could then sell it and pocket tha t money, thereby reducing the cost of the purchase overall. to get an idea what an 08 TL might be worth in 2015, the best analysis I could come up with is to look at what a 8 model year old TL is worth now in 2009 with siilar mileage... so look at a 2002 TL w/100k miles. according to cars.com, the average asking price on a car like that is $8000-9000. that's actually a lot higher than I had expected. so if I BUY - at the end of my purchase, that used 2008 TL is supposedly going to be worth let's say $8500. another facotr you have to consider is that on a lease you typically pay for ZERO repairs. you only pay for the upkeep/maintenance. oil changes and stuff. maybe you might have to do brake pads or a set of tires..but you basically escape from the lease w/out havig to fix anything. the car is under warranty the entire time you have it, and you only pay for consumables that you would have to pay for on any car..new or used. they all use gas, tires, oil, brakes..so those costs are consistent regardless of whether you buy or lease. BUT, if you buy a CPO used car with 15k on it, and then you drive it up to 100k, you are probably going to have to fix something. the CPO warranty will run out on most stuff at about 62k miles. you have a powertrain up to 100k..so the big big ticket stuff like motor/tranny is covered. but figure you have the same brakes, tires, and then maye you get something like a leaky radiator, or a button that breaks, or a water pump that fails, or a some computer sensor that goes out... that stuff might not be under warranty, and from 62k - 100k you foot the bill for that stuff. those are costs the guy who is leasing never pays. so another big question, factor to estimate is what will it cost for THAT stuff on teh purchase? hard to say. in general, i would expect those coss to be fairly low as the TL is a pretty reliable car, and since the big big ticket stuff is covered under a CPO warranty, i wouldn't get hit with a tranny rebuilt or blown motor...only the smaller stuff. assumign you don't have a lemon....you might have say... $1000-3000 max in these costs over the life of the loan. this is not including oil changes, tires, brakes..i'm thiking of actual repair visits where you have ot fix something that isn't a warranty item..a water pump, an alternator...crap like that. i honestly think the 3000 figure is kind of high...lets say $2000 as a guesstimate. So leasing has total costs of $37270. (TWO 36 month leases back to back) purchase a CPO 2008. total finance costs over 72mo = $37,270. assume an extra $2500 in long term upkeep, but a "residual value" at the end of myloan of about $8500. So $37,270 + $2500 - $8500 = $31,270. so assumig you paid the car off and once it wqs paid off you sold it, and pocketed the money, and assumig my figures are right, your net monthly car costs average out to : lease - $517 purchase - $434. difference of $82/month. the million dollar question si whether it is worth an extra $82 a month, to always have a car that is never mor ethan a few years old, under warranty, and new. you'd pay more, but you'd get to go through TWO newer cars, instead of driving one "old" car the whole time. depends on how much you like cars. so you can see that really, buying a clean CPO car, and even with normal maintenance, should overall cost less in the long run, as the car has a net value at the end that actually reduces your effective "cost". BUT, that $8500 "equity" isn't cash..it's tied up in the car..so if you never sell it you don't see that money. i gues the alternative is that you DON'T sell it, and then for the next THREE years you DRIVe it for free, and only incur another $2500-3000 in costs to repair it. so if you go out to 9 years...then you have a whopping $1000/year in costs. while the guy leasing has to incur yet another huge set of costs to lease yet another car.. so over 9 years.. the leasing guy pays $55,905 over 9 years. the guy who buys pays $42,770.... the savings start to accelerate the longer you keep/drive the old paid off car. now here is the real questio - do you REALLY want to drive that 2008 CPO TL for the next NINE years. hell no. there are other intantigl efactors you cant' put a dollar value on. how about the peace of mind of havin ga brand new car that will not break down and leave you stranded? how about the fun of havin ga new car? newer technology? new/updated safety items? these factors all could be reduced to some dollar figure...but it's very subjective. some people who are NTO car people, honestly could care less about how they get from point A to B and the buy it an dkeep it 10 years works for them b/c it's the cheapest possible way to do it. in fact, they dont drive a TL, they drive a basic 4 cyl accord iwth cloth and no nav.  if you purely look at the short term costs - over 36 months... Assuming ZERO d |
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i really wrote a long thred..so long it deleted some of my post!! sorry guys. i got carried away.. bottom line - i think leasing a new 09 is a smarter move than buying a used CPO 08. unelss the dealers really reduce what they are asking for on teh 08s... right now, most dealers are asking and won't budge of asking for about $27-28k for a CPO 08 base w/nav. at that price, it makes more sense to lease a new 09. as the price goes down and the spread between new/used increases..the CPO might be a better move..but in the short term - 36-60 months out, leasing is the way to go.
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Replying to: 23109vc (Jul 17, 2009 10:27 am) good luck Rob |
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Robert- I think you're right in that the CPO cars are not necessarily any better than a private party car...in terms of quality. I'm sure some CPO cars are trashed and some are pristine. I've seen some that looked and drove as if they were actually new, and others that were clean...but n ot *that* clean... if you know what I mean. the one thing you do get from CPO is the extension of the warranty. you get another year and 12k on top of the existing factory warranty, and they extend the powertrain warranty from 6 yr / 70k to 7yr, 100k. so you get a little bit more in terms of warranty. if you found a used 08 with low miles, you'd have as much or more warranty coverage as the new car... you are right about the dealers trying to jack up the used car prices. i almost wonder if b/c the market is so depressed,they are trying to make bigger profits on teh used cars...the new cars pricing is harder to manipulate wiht so many people hitting the web and verifying the cash back incentives, invoice pricing, etc... butg on a used car, you never know how cheap they really got it for...so they could be really j acking up the price and you'll never know... I do know what the 08s sold for in the end of 08. the base w/nav sold for about $29-30k and the TL-S sold for $31,500-32000. i see used 08s with 10-20k miles and the asking price is $34k....nuts. they always give me the same line..in 2008 there were incentivs, now we don't have those... i try to counter with "yeah, but once the cars start selling NEW for $32k, incentives or NOT, the price has come down. whenever a dealer puts cash on the car, it lowers the price/value b/c someoen else bought it for less". they just repear the incentives thing... one guy actually told me they have become liek collectors items and have gone UP in value...yeah...SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURE.... the TL-S is a collector car!!! ha! tough decision on what to do. buy used or go lease new. each has it's pros/cons. thansk for all the feedback Robert. how you likin' that new TL??? did you ever consider going for the AWD model?
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Replying to: 23109vc (Jul 17, 2009 12:36 pm) |
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yeah it's nuts. the ask prices on used 08 TLs is high. i wonder if with the economy going down, people are buying used cars instead of buying/leasing new ones? so the dealers and private parties can ask more? or is it that th eTL just holds it's value too well??? |
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went in with intention of going CPO TL but i decided to check out the lease on '09 TL. non nav model price of $32,895. 10k miles per year $428/month (NJ taxes rolled in) $2100 out of pocket. i told them i had to check with a leasing company i have used and they said to let them have another shot if he can beat that so they can probably do a little better. what do you guys think of that deal?
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Hi forum members, I am planning on getting an Acura TL 2009 (Grigio Metallic) with Parchment interior. I am a little concerned after the test drive about the interior color. It looks a little lighter than I thought. The test drive model had a few spots (maybe from rough use) but since I absolutely want mine to be clean, can someone share their experience? How does it look? Is it easy to get dirt spots and scratches on (more than let's say Ebony interior)? How easy or difficult is it to clean the spots? Finally what about the Ebony interior? I may get that one if Parchment experience is not great but it's not my first preference (have an Accord with black interior). How does it look with Grigio Metallic? Will appreciate any feedback I can get. Thanks.
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Replying to: prchohan (Jul 19, 2009 8:20 am)
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Replying to: seif (Jul 18, 2009 1:41 pm) selling price 33500 Cash due at signing 1039 (1st month, reg, fees) 436 + tax month = 470 in so cal 36months 10k year shopped around for about 1 week. all the dealers in so cal were pretty much willing to do the deal. |
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