Last post on Sep 30, 2013 at 4:14 PM
You are in the Subaru Legacy & Outback
What is this discussion about?
Subaru, Subaru Legacy, Subaru Outback, Sedan, Wagon
Your Community Leaders are ateixeira and rsholland.
Jan 08, 2004 (10:47 am)
After owning 6 Accords and two Civics, I bought a Subaru Legacy GT Wagon in 2001, and I wouldn't go back, my next car will be Subaru although that is a considerable timespan away.
I actually came to Subaru by default following the demise of the Accord wagon, whilst I loved my Accords and I generally found them to be bulletproof, I find that the GT is more refined in terms of roadnoise, is more fun to drive and the AWD is incomparable.
While this is probably largely perception, the GT feels to be a safer car, you just get that feeling when you sit in it, it just feels more planted and a more substantial vehicle overall.
After almost 3 years of ownership this car still puts a smile on my face every time I get into it, and I love it as much today as the day I got it, I will be perfectly happy to drive this car for many more years.
#472 of 10838 Honda > Subaru = AWD
Jan 08, 2004 (11:25 am)
I own a 2001 LLBean H6 Outback w/ 53K and a 1996 Accord LX 4 w/ 113K. I'm waiting for the 2005 Outback H6 sedan to arrive - in monotone (w/ memory seats, please) - to replace the Accord. Looks like we won't see one until the Feb. 6th press release.
Although the Accord generally handles well for a Japanese car - it's good in snow - it still doesn't come close to the AWD's planted feel. I am finding that once you go AWD, you never go back. I never realized how much the Accord (or any 2WD car) slips in rain until I drove an AWD car for a couple years. I'm not talking about sliding out in a turn - I'm talking about a random, constant slippage sideways/back/forth while going 55-75 mph on a straight highway (w/ excellent tires). It's so slight you would never feel it until you get used to the AWD feel. At times there is only 1 drive wheel connected to the pavement - and sometimes, none!
The Accord is also a tinny car to me - the 96 at least. And although they have improved the car and crash stats from the 96 I have , Subaru seems to make a beefer, safer car... And w/ the Detroit show showing more concepts looking like tanks, the hummer trend is unfortunately here to stay.
I've resigned myself to arming my family when it comes to my purchase this year... Excellent crash stats all around and AWD on the ground.
Now if there was an AWD Accord....
Jan 08, 2004 (11:28 am)
There is an AWD Accord, just not in North America, in Europe yes.
Jan 08, 2004 (11:39 am)
I'll stick w/ Subaru... the H6 engine seems to be a winner... I hope their tweeking doesn't mess things up...
#475 of 10838 accords and subarus...
Jan 08, 2004 (11:43 am)
I've owned 2 new Accords (an 88 LXi and a 91 SE) and a new 99 Civic Ex prior to buying my 2001 Outback and 2004 WRX...the Hondas were all GREAT cars that were imaculately finished and extremely reliable. I ended up going to Subaru, though, because Honda doesn't offer an AWD wagon and I won't buy an SUV.
Although I had quite a few problems with the Outback during the 55K miles I owned it, my WRX has been flawless during its first 13k miles and I expect it to hold up as well as any of my Hondas. To me, the WRX feels like it's put together better than my Outback, but that's hard to quantify.
Having said that, we just bought a 2004 Accord EX-L that is in another league all together in terms of quality feel inside and out. Everything in the 04 Accord moves with a precision feel and has an expensive look to it. Definitely a step above my Subarus in terms of fit and finish. The FWD Accord is fine in most cases, especially since we also have the WRX for trips to the snow, but I'm not sure it would suffice as our only car. Having owned AWD Subies since 2001, I don't think I could be without it for those trips over I80 when it's snowing. It's so reassuring to have all 4 wheels clawing for traction in crappy weather, it makes me forget about all the things that Honda does better.
#476 of 10838 Showroom arrival...
Jan 08, 2004 (1:00 pm)
Depends on which model you want. The NA (naturally aspirated or non-turbo) Legacy 2.5i is starting production in March so should hit showrooms in May with the Outback following in June and the Legacy 2.5GT (with turbo) in July.
#477 of 10838 How do you get 'by July'
Jan 08, 2004 (1:02 pm)
the turbo is going to be at dealers?
#478 of 10838 Accord vs Legacy
Jan 08, 2004 (5:33 pm)
Three months ago I traded in my '99 Accord EX V6 Coupe (with 100,000 trouble-free miles) for an '04 Legacy 35th Aniv Sedan 5 spd manual.
- Exterior fit and finish is better on the Accord. For example, the Legacy's driver door doesn't close quite right (It requires some muscle and I can hear the door scraping on the latch if I close it really slow - If you're used to GM; you won't notice anything wrong.)
- Accord has a much stiffer ride (almost uncomfortable); the Legacy has a better ride (and still handles well)
- Accord's steering is a little too over-assisted; Legacy's is weighted better (best road feel of any car I've driven).
- Accord's 200 HP Automatic 3.0 V6 got better gas mileage (29.5 mpg) on highway vs. Legacy's 5 spd manual 2.5 (27.5 mpg). The reason is the 5 spd is geared way too low for normal highway driving. The 2.5 revs at 3,000 at 70 MPH vs. the Accord's ~2,700 at 70 MPH. I don't recommend buying a manual transmission Subaru until they add an extra gear (or figure out how to make it geared higher).
- FWD Accord slipped and slid in bad weather (and torque-steered under hard acceleration in dry weather). Legacy's 2.5 doesn't have enough torque to torque-steer, but it's grip in rain and snow is uncanny. It's unstoppable in a foot of snow. The AWD makes all the difference in the world in snow and ice.
Overall I'm glad I bought the Subaru - it came in very handy in the last snow storms here in the Northeast. It's actually a pleasure to drive in the snow. I'll never own another FWD car again. The only regret I have is getting the ridiculously low-geared manual transmission (next time I'll test drive at highway speeds before buying) - I'll put up with the '04 for a few more months until the '05s come out.
#479 of 10838 Torque steer
Jan 08, 2004 (11:16 pm)
"Legacy's 2.5 doesn't have enough torque to torque-steer..."...
It certainly does. You have the manual, so you can't put it into front drive only mode like I can with the auto, but if only the front wheels were pulling, there'd be some torque steer. The rear wheels get power too quickly and keep the car on the straight and narrow for you to notice any torque steer. Another beauty of AWD!
Jan 09, 2004 (11:00 am)
Over the past year i have been drooling over pics of the new Subie. However, after seeing the US bound version, there was not that same excitment.
I gave it some though and realised that the extended front and rear bumpers resulted in a slightly GM looking car(seen on Subdriven.com). Models sent to the rest of the world have a crisper look.
I hope they fix that for future models.