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You are in the Subaru Legacy & Outback
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Subaru, Subaru Legacy, Subaru Outback, Sedan, Wagon
Your Community Leaders are ateixeira and rsholland.
#1619 of 10838 Official lurker status is gone
May 21, 2004 (6:38 pm)
I think my official "lurker" status is gone. I've been lurking in this forum since October or November of last year and enjoying all the good discussions. Now I have some questions I hope someone can help out with. Allow me to apologize up front for the length of this one but let me to set the stage for my questions:
Late last year I was giving a serious look at the new WRX (2004 model with restyled headlights) and happened to come across some information about a new Legacy that would have the same engine as the WRX STI. It seemed pretty promising so I put off my WRX purchase to wait for this new Legacy.
While waiting, I built several spreadsheets comparing the virtues and vices (price, gas mileage, interior room, horsepower, torque, etc) of several cars: the WRX, Infiniti G35, Lexus IS300, Acura TL, Mazda 6 and RX-8, BMW 330i, Audi A4 and S4, and (for grins) the Jaguar XK8 convertible. Since then I have narrowed the field down to the G35 (sedan, 6MT, RWD) and the Legacy GT Limited.
Today I went to my local San Antonio Subaru dealership and took a look at the few 2005 models they got off the truck this morning: an Outback LL Bean and a Legacy 2.5i sedan. I looked at the sedan and had one word: wow. I looked at the LL Bean and the dealer told me to stop smiling or he would have to sell it to me.
Now I have one choice (Legacy) but many questions. I'll put them in my next post. Thanks for providing such great info in the forum!
May 21, 2004 (6:56 pm)
OK... I looked at the LL Bean and was VERY impressed by the taupe leather interior and wood trim. I have not seen anything quite that stylish and appealing in any car I have looked at in the past year.
Currently, I have a 94 Mazda Miata M-Edition that has a tan interior and some woodgrain accents. The LL Bean leather was lighter as were the wood accents. Very contemporary... did I mention appealing?
Question #1: does anyone know for certain if that same woodgrain is available in the Legacy GT Limited with the taupe leather or is it LL Bean only? The dealer wasn't 100% sure either way. The brochure he had (the same one Control Freak scanned into www.legacysti.com) noted on page 22 "Titanium Metallic interior trim with woodgrain-patterned accents" (footnote #2 at the very bottom). I am guessing yes.
Question #2: does anyone know for sure when the GTs are going to be at the dealerships? The guy I spoke with locally indicated some time in mid to late June. If they had had a GT Limited in Atlantic Blue Pearl with an interior the same as that LL Bean's, I would have probably been buying a car today.
#1621 of 10838 Comment and one additional question
May 21, 2004 (7:51 pm)
Comment: has anyone taken note of the cars that Edmunds has chosen as the default "comparison cars" for the GT? Audi A4, Infiniti G35, Lexus IS300, and Saab 9-3? I find that rather interesting. Maybe it's just me.
Question: Given that the G35 was one of my two finalists in my new car search and given that I want to make sure I am getting the right car (I would like to keep my car for 10+ years), I did the full "print summary" comparison between the GT Limited and the G35.
To the G35, I added the premium package (Includes Bose premium 200-watt, 7-speaker audio system with RDS, AM/FM cassette and Nd woofer, power tilt/slide glass sunroof with one-touch open/close and pinch protection, dual climate control with rear vents (in the back of the center console arm rest) and interior air filter, driver's seat memory with entry/exit assist, 4-way power adjustable passenger seat, reclining rear seats with adjustable outboard head restraints, auto on/off headlights, Homelink Universal Transceiver, auto-dimming rearview mirror, all power windows one-touch up/down and full-size spare tire with matching alloy wheel.) I also added the aero body kit and sunroof to arrive at a $37,500 MSRP. I loaded up the GT and came up with $30,500. I fail to see anything substantial in the G35 that warrants a $7000 premium as far as significant deal-breaker kinds of items. Yes, the G35 has stability control, it has a full size spare, reclining rear seats, the Infiniti name, auto up/down windows, etc but am I missing anything huge? Yes, I realize the G35 6MT is RWD and not AWD but that is not a huge thing in my book. The G35 has performance tires on it which I will probably add to the GT ASAP which would cost a bit.
Yes, the GT gives up 10 HP to the G35 and maybe a tenth of a second or two but I'm not Joe Ricer who needs a WRX STI. I want a nice, upscale car with some oomph that I can use to haul my family around on not too long trips. Right now we have to take my wife's minivan everywhere because my other car is a Miata. I personally don't mind putting the kids in the trunk but we get odd stares at the mall when we let them out. (I'm just kidding... don't call CPS on me)
Any thoughts or observations would be appreciated.
#1622 of 10838 some answers and comments
May 21, 2004 (8:07 pm)
I got the brochures the other day and, as you pointed out, it does state that the GT Limited with the Taupe interior will have the wood-grain accents. Like you, I would assume that will be the same as on the Outback.
That wood trim is very nice. The matte finish is much classier than the shiny look of the current Outbacks (and that of many other cars these days). The new interior, IMHO, is so much improved as to put it at the same level as Audis and Acura, not to mention VWs.
As for the comparison to the G35, I think the Infiniti is a nice car. Being in Denver, I'd prefer the AWD, but since that is not available with the 6sp, I wouldn't consider it. It will be interesting to hear comparisons from people test driving once the turbo models are available. Despite the similar horsepower, I would expect the overall character of the turbo engine in the Legacy and the ubiquitous V6 in the G35 to be quite different.
To me, the Legacy GT is a very affordable competitor to the previous gen S4. Same hp, turbo powered, awd, etc. But more room, better reliability. All for $30k or less. I'm lovin' it.
May 21, 2004 (9:18 pm)
Must be small kids to fit in the trunk of a Miata.
#1624 of 10838 Re: One very minor point [brady_bunch #1618]
May 22, 2004 (5:03 am)
Ah. I knew that the slot on the dash would be for a future display for the navigation system. I never even thought of the slot in the glove compartment being for the naviagtion computer. Regardless, I wouldn't be getting NAVI so it is still a cool spot to store the manual out of the way of everything else.
Thanks for the clarification though.
#1625 of 10838 my test drive
May 22, 2004 (5:33 am)
Wa-hoo! I, along with my 49 yr. old padre, test drove a Regal Blue 2.5i last night, happily without the salesman accompanying us. As far as drives I've been on, this one was fairly extensive- nearly 15 miles.
Overall, this is an extremely well executed vehicle, and I was very impressed.
One of the things that stood out immediately was the comfort of the front seats- though they arent "sport seats", they definitely cradled the body. (The car we drove was still in plastic, it had actually not even been given a stock number yet, so I cannot comment on the quality of the fabric.)
The steering wheel is small diameter, the center stack is well laid out and interesting to look at, and I greatly appreciated the trick trip computer, which I didnt realize was standard, but found to be a very nice feature.
Braking felt solid, and the pedal reassuring, perhaps just a little spongy for the very first inch of travel, but overall very good. As expected, the car cornered fairly flatly, I pushed the envelope a bit on several off ramps, and was very happy (and amused!) with the car's responses. Given the handling, the ride was remarkable on some of Jersey's more daunting road irregularities and pockmarks.
Finally, cruising yielded little to no wind noise, and the boxer engine was remarkably quiet at speed.
Now, for some negatives.
Juice, I'm sorry, but I do not agree with you that this vehicle will hit 60 in 8.5. In fact, Id bet it will need another second. While I do realize this was a very green car, and as such, I did not nail the accelerator, I did rev it from a stop up past 5000 RPM, and the vehicle does not step off like the 4 cylinder Accords or even our 02 4cyl Camry, which clocks slightly slower than the Accord. This was one aspect my dad also noticed, without me mentioning it first. The 2.5i certainly isnt lacking for power, but it doesnt accelerate as aggressively as I expected, or would like. Maybe using brake torquing techniques the mags will do 8.5, but not I.
I was however, impressed with the transmission. I didnt find the "Sport" setting significantly beneficial, in fact, in passing, I thought it was a bit annoying- it REALLY holds the lower gear, even after you ease pressure on the accelerator, which causes a lugging for a few seconds. Otherwise, shifts are virtually undectable and mapping of the 4EAT is efficiently done. I do wonder, though, how much the MPG figures would improve with the 5 speed auto, what the cost to Subaru, and its consumers, really would have been had SoA/FHI used the extra ratio in these basic models.
The rear seat IS smallish, but I suppose thats not a big deal since this car purports to compete more so wearing higher line/GT dress, with vehicles whose back seats are also small. That said, anyone expecting Altima/Accord/Camry room will not find it. They are well shaped though, and space is utilized efficiently.
Some cheap details: I find the hood prop rod unnecessary, the donut spare is dinky, and I really wish the rear seat folded, especially given the sedan's diminutive (though adequate trunk).
I'm pretty confident that my parents will be getting one once their IMBA membership hits the 6 month requirement for invoice pricing.. or whenever the dealer can come in at invoice.
IMO, this new Subaru is the most competitive Legacy yet. For anyone looking at the Camcords, but might have an interest in AWD and not really needing a large backseat, this car is the way to go.
PS- Our test car stickered at $22,9xx. The only option was the auto-dimming rear view mirror.
#1626 of 10838 Re: [brady_bunch #1619] Rule #1, never smile at the dealer...
May 22, 2004 (5:42 am)
It's a dead-giveaway that you like the car! (Ya gotta make the salesman think it's the great price he's giving you that sold the car!)
#1627 of 10838 Answer to Brady Bunch
May 22, 2004 (5:56 am)
Went to the local Subie dealer in MPLS and looked at the 05' 2.5i sedan. Turbo won't arrive for about 2 weeks. To me the 05' seems tighter than the 99'GT we had a year ago. Since they didn't have a turbo,I didn't drive the car, but heres what I got out of it. If they decide to put NAV. in the car, watch out for increased attention from the state police just because of where it is installed. Since I didn't drive it and WE are also comparing it to a G35 with the Premium Pak. and body kit, for the tightness of the G35 I don't see the justification for the $6500 difference. But if this turbo doesn't drive as good as I think it should, I won't blink twice to buy the G35 over the Subie. But I have 2 weeks to wait till a turbo arrives at a Luther dealership in Minnesota..
#1628 of 10838 Re: my test drive [alpha01 #1625]
May 22, 2004 (6:08 am)
The legacy I looked at yesterday had Leather, sport shift, power driver seat, and 6cd in dash for about $26400. I'm hoping the turbo comes in at about $3000 more...