Last post on Jul 01, 2013 at 5:50 PM
You are in the Cadillac DTS
What is this discussion about?
Cadillac DTS, Automotive News, Sedan
Nov 13, 2007 (3:30 pm)
I understand that a new DTS is planned in 2010 or 11. They might combine the STS and DTS. I hope that Cadillac won't reduce the size of the DTS. If I'm going to end up with a mid-size DTS when the model change happens then I'll go with an Avalon or Lexus for sure. There are a lot of mid-sized models to choose from but there are presently very few full size cars -essentially the DTS and the Town Car. The DTS is a big seller for Cadillac and if they lose their DTS buyer base by downsizing this car it will be a big mistake. Some people including most of us on this forum enjoy a big car that one can drive all day without back strain and one that holds 4 or 5 people comfortably and all their baggage..
#672 of 896 DTS -Tires question
Nov 13, 2007 (5:37 pm)
I have a performance dts order , looking at the tires that coming on the car get such a bade write up on Tire Rack and another tire site , the bridgestone rated poor , i am thinking of putting on yokohama s 4 , but dealer says that change the tires could effect it so much as far as vibration and ride , s 4 have much better write up I am just looking for input if you changed especially to yokohama
#673 of 896 Re: New DTS [dispencer2]
Nov 13, 2007 (9:46 pm)
I very much agree with you and in fact have put my ideas in to my car ownership with both a Town Car and DTS. The Lincoln has been my first and the DTS my third Deville. While STS is a nice car I have never been all that excited about it . There is no question that the DTS has more cutting edge technology than Town Car but they are both very nice with the Town Car the more attractive (in my opinion) of the two. The interesting thing about my Town Car is that while it is 400 pounds heavier than DTS but is about 15 % more fuel efficient than DTS. I would also be inclined to try a Toyota or other Japanese car should Cadillac do the merging of DTS & STS with the mid size result.
#674 of 896 Re: New DTS [dispencer2]
Nov 14, 2007 (7:37 am)
What I have read here and there (various car magazines) is that the Deville(DTS) will be a RWD car. The RWD platform will probably be new, and the Lucerne will also use this platform. The platform will be similar to the Pontiac G8, but the North American production version will probably have a range of sizes so that the DTS should be a large version. I am not sure what the STS will be, but could be a shorter version of the DTS.
While the Deville has been a long time big seller for Cadillac, the CTS now sells about as well. The DTS sales seem to be decreasing, while the new CTS is selling even better than the first generation model, which had a plasic interior. If you want really big vehicles the Buick Enclave is quite large. The Town Car will probably remain in production for a while too. Cadillac is said to be thinking about a true premium luxury model (something that might compare with the Mercedes S-class). I am not sure that Cadillac knows how to do premium luxury though, as the last true premium luxury Cadillac was the 90-series in the 1930's era. The Eldorado Brougham of the late 50's was not really a premium luxury model and failed in any case.
Nov 14, 2007 (12:09 pm)
I thought they tried to compete with MB when they came out with the Allante in the 1980s, which, if I recall, was priced over $50K and was an expensive boat anchor...
Maybe I am the one snookered by advertising, but it just seems to me that Cadillac has tried for years to compete with the supposed quality and reputation of Mercedes, but has always fallen so far short that it is laughable...
Maybe now, as manufacturing methods seem to be coming together, Caddy makes a better car and MB has had quality problems, possibly due to their (supposed) arrogance...
But if/when MB gets its act together again, will Caddy even stand a chance, meaning can Caddy sell a $100K auto while S-Class autos now routinely surpass $100K sticker, and folks still buy it...
Caddy may make a great car, but will never command the proces of MB, as most folks simply do not place them as real competitors...maybe CTS competes with C-Class, but does a DTS REALLY compare to an S-600???...I would doubt it...
#676 of 896 Re: sls002 [marsha7]
Nov 15, 2007 (7:49 am)
Cadillac shipped both the Allante and the Eldorado Brougham off to Italy to give them some sort of European flair to justify putting a very high price tag on what was otherwise basically a copy of a cheaper production model. The Eldorado Brougham was basically the Fleetwood Sixty body, while the Allante was the Eldorado with the rear seat removed with a shorter body. Both cars should have had bodies that were designed to be stronger than the lower end Cadillacs.
However, beginning with the G-bodies (the 1995 Oldsmobile Aurora/Buick Riviera), GM has bodies that are comparable with the Mercedes E-class. The RWD sigma platform Cadillacs (CTS, STS and SRX) are probably even better than the FWD G-bodies. However, Mercedes has a long history of building high end vehicles, and Cadillac's history is one of building medium priced luxury cars, so Cadillac will not be able to demand the same price as a similar Mercedes.
The DTS is as big as an S-class, but the S-class has an even stronger, stiffer, more vault like body than the E-class, while the DTS body is probably not quite an E-class for structure. The sigma bodies are probably closer to the E-class.
Nov 15, 2007 (7:15 pm)
You help make my point...why is it always that we can't make a chassis that is stronger and stiffer like the MB???
While I am NOT a metallurgist, I simply will not believe that Caddy or any carmaker does not know that its chassis flexes too much or the suspension needs to be stiffened...
Why can't every Chevy, Ford and caddy have the suspension of a BMW???...unless BMW makes it cars out of gold, their suspensions could be duplicated by GM for pennies...their shocks are no different, they either use control arms or struts, and we could reverse engineer anything BMW (or Honda or Toy) does, and make our cars much better on the road...
Why don't we do it???...I am quite sure that BMW does not know any more about auto suspensions than we do, but they sure seem to implement it much better...we could do the same, and for less money, given our economies of scale...
#678 of 896 Re: sls002 [marsha7]
Nov 16, 2007 (7:40 am)
GM's G-body FWD cars were as good as BMW and Mercedes for chassis flex (or stiffness). Ride and handling are a combination of tire and suspension components. I think that Cadillac's sigma platform is as good as BMW or Mercedes. However, there are differences in tires as well as the suspensions. In the end, the customer has choices, and whether you like the Cadillac or the BMW better depends on personal choice. The sigma platform is expensive to build. I think the sigma suspension is a better design than BMW's. What Cadillac needs to do is not copy BMW, but design something better, which I think that they may have done. There is some question about whether the CTS should be compared to the 3-series, which is in the same price range; or is the CTS really a 5-series car since they are about the same size.
The DTS owners in this forum like the big FWD G-body and seem unwilling to consider any RWD de Ville replacement that might be smaller or more like a sports sedan. They are probably not interested in paying something like $100,000 for a DTS that really compares with an S-class Mercedes much less a Maybach.
#679 of 896 Re: sls002 [sls002]
Nov 16, 2007 (7:01 pm)
"They are probably not interested in paying something like $100,000 for a DTS that really compares with an S-class Mercedes much less a Maybach. "
Exactly--at least for me. Having become re-aquainted with RWD via my 300C, I wouldn't mind a RWD deVille as long as it's priced similar to today's DTS. But if it were to jump even to the XLR's price range I'd start looking at Buicks or another Chrysler.
And I am totally in agreement with idea that Cadillac should chart its own course. Trying to create an American MB or BMW will not likely convince any current MB or BMW owners to switch. They're really not buying the mechanical or handling nature of their cars. They're buying the cache.