Last post on Sep 22, 2012 at 9:23 AM
You are in the Lexus ES
What is this discussion about?
Lexus ES 300, Lexus ES 330, Transmission, Sedan
#897 of 1407 Re: ES330 Hesitation [motownusa]
Jan 08, 2006 (10:22 am)
Here's a statement I found by Toyota and Lexus about the "Unintended Accelleration" condition which may help to clarify it further:
Reports for Camry, Camry Solara And ES 300/330 Throttle Control System
April 13, 2005 The auto industry has experienced a long history of isolated reports of alleged sudden acceleration, involving vehicles of virtually every make. Numerous investigations going back many decades have consistently suggested that these incidents were unrelated to vehicle malfunction.
In its current preliminary evaluation of Camry, Solara and ES 300 vehicles, NHTSA has recently revised the number of complaints under consideration from 37 down to 12, concluding that correct application of the brakes would have controlled the vehicle. None of the complaints involve any injuries.
Customer safety remains our highest priority. We are carefully studying the remaining complaints, in cooperation with NHTSA, to determine the facts in each instance. But this process requires time and care. Any speculation about possible causes would be premature and counterproductive.
It is important to note that no specific defect has been identified by NHTSA, nor is there any recall of these vehicles. Customers who have any questions or concerns should contact the Toyota Customer Experience Center at 1-800-331-4331 or Lexus Customer Satisfaction line at 1-800-25-LEXUS.
Here's a 2004 quote from a Consumer Reports article on the same subject:
NHTSA Closes Probe of Unintended Acceleration in Toyota, Lexus Models
July 28, 2004
Federal safety investigators have closed their probe into reports of unintended acceleration in 2002 and 2003 Toyota Camry, Camrty Solara and Lexus ES300 models. The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) opened the investigation after receiving reports of 30 accidents, including one in which a pedestrian was alledged to be injured.
The probe centered around the cars' electronic throttle control. Many newer cars transmit acceleration signals electronically rather than using the traditional movable steel cable.
NHTSA said it analyzed many of the cars involved in the mishaps and found nothing abnormal with the throttle controls. It said sudden surges are sometimes caused by drivers who are unfamiliar with their new vehicles.
#898 of 1407 Re: ES330 Hesitation [hylyner]
Jan 08, 2006 (11:45 am)
The unintended acceleration is a separate issue. The article about hesitation that references the NHTSA investigation came out in Feb. 2005, well before the issue you are referencing.
Feb. 5--The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration plans to look into a transmission hesitation problem in certain Lexus and Toyota models to determine whether to go forward with a full investigation .
It is possible the NHTSA decided not to "go forward with a full investigation". Soon after this article is when Toyota announced the new software upgrade. That could have satisfied NHTSA.
#899 of 1407 Re: ES330 Hesitation [scoti1]
Jan 08, 2006 (12:03 pm)
Scoti, it should be pretty clear by now there was no investigation about Hesitation by NHTSA. I really didn't intend to split hairs with you on this, but I repeat: there is no record of NHTSA investigation about "Hesitation" for any model of Toyota or Lexus, anywhere. Also, I did qualify my posts as locating only "Unintended Acceleration", nothing about "Hesitation", and that the two were "separate issues".
I cannot say whether or not you, the Pittsburg Post, or anyone else intentionally misinterpreted the announcement, but I believe many are getting tired of seeing it repeated endlessly as though it did happen when it did not.
#900 of 1407 Hesitation
Jan 08, 2006 (12:34 pm)
In the article Scoti referenced there is also the following info which seems to be often conveniently overlooked. I doubt it will make a difference though as there is obviously a bias against Toyota in some of the posts. hylyner, I agree with everything you and motownusa have written btw.
A search of NHTSA records and interviews with Consumer Reports magazine also show owners of other car makes are suffering from the same hesitation problem, including BMW's 3 Series, Ford Explorers and Escapes, and Dodge Durango 4x4.
David Champion, senior director of Consumer Reports' Auto Test Center in Connecticut, said the magazine's testers have encountered the same problems in the Audi A6 2.7T, the Audi Allroad, the Mazda6 equipped with the V-6 engine, and the Volkswagen Jetta 1.8T.
#901 of 1407 Re: Hesitation [billran]
Jan 08, 2006 (2:01 pm)
Yes, you are quite correct verifying other maufacturers have had complaints of hesitation with their DBW systems. It's been raised any number of times in discussions, but for some reason is quickly dismissed and marginalized with comments like "But Toyota gets more than others."
Having seen two or more months worth of mostly hyped up rhetoric about it, I think we now know why this gets said.
#903 of 1407 The Real Issue...
Jan 08, 2006 (4:56 pm)
After agonizing for several years on this issue, I think it is important to keep a focus on what is important, and that is whether Lexus will fix this problem in our vehicles.
Clearly, the answer is NO. This vehicle has been "out" now for almost 5 years, and Toyota still has not even admitted that there is a problem. One can extrapolate that to conclude that Toyota will not even come close to getting to where they will pay for a recall or a very expensive drive train redesign to fix existing vehicles. It is simply NOT going to happen.
As far as whether this problem is "widespread", I think that whether this problem exists in all vehicles is a topic that should be put to bed. I can repeat the problem is every vehicle that I drive (and I've driven many loaners), from 2002, 2003, 2004 2005 and 2006. The PROBLEM is in ALL of them. For those of you who claim not to have the problem, trust me, I could repeat it in YOUR car. (The symptom does vary slightly from one vehicle to the next however.)
And don't bother waiting until the 2007 comes out - I'd bet a LOT of money that the problem will be there, too.
#904 of 1407 Interesting Discussion.
Jan 08, 2006 (4:58 pm)
It gets better every day Gents. I'll be leaving your fair city of Cincinnati Tuesday and gonna miss this discussion. It could easy get to be compelling. Internet back home is bloody rotten and it takes forever to download a site like this much less have your post sent. I have learned lots in a short time, especially as billran fears I too suspicion a definite bias says against Toyota is alive and well hereabouts. I wonder why this is? Says hyliner, more like somebody's trying to make Toyota look bad perhaps? Too bad, because they sell brilliant cars and trucks where I come from. Good bye all, and thanks for letting me butt in. You have a great country here.
#905 of 1407 If you're on the top....
Jan 08, 2006 (6:46 pm)
of the "heap", you're sure to get "rained" on.
#906 of 1407 Re: If you're on the top.... [wwest]
Jan 09, 2006 (5:36 am)