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Subaru Forester, Engine, Wagon
Jun 20, 2003 (11:52 am)
krccrk very helpfully says, "My boost guage shows negative boost most of the time for just normal in-town driving in moderate traffic. Maybe the actual mpg won't be bad at all."
Thanks very much for this useful information. It confirms what I've been saying: In moderate driving, the XT will rarely if ever get into the high-fuel-flow boost phase. That almost surely would also have been true during EPA testing. Therefore, the true reason for the XT's disappointing EPA ratings (much lower than a WRX, and even lower than the 300BHP STi!) remain a mystery.
Jun 20, 2003 (11:55 am)
"John: Maybe those EPA testers just loved having the XT boost kick in and drove the MPG numbers down! Ken"
On a dyno? I can see overdoing it on the road, experiencing the actual acceleration sensation, but it seems that something would be lost sitting on a stationary dyno...
Also - are vehicles undergoing EPA testing actually operated by humans, or is a computer operating the throttle? I would have assumed the latter, in order to make the results more standardized and comparable.
Jun 20, 2003 (11:58 am)
Ken placates me by saying, "jack: I think you're doing the right thing by waiting for an XT on allocation. I would do the same."
I suppose. But I've now been telephoned by TWO dealers in my area who have 5-speed XTs sitting there, waiting to be bought. First, last Monday, a silver one; today a red one arrived. My dealer is supposed to be the highest-volume Subaru dealer in the Pacific Northwest; I can't figure out why he will evidently be the last one to get a silver 5-speed!- jb
#440 of 476 Boost gauge BAD news
Jun 20, 2003 (12:09 pm)
"It completely blocks the view of the temp and fuel gauges. They really need to find a better place to put it."
This makes me very unhappy. Every picture of the gauge I've seen was on WRXs, and it was always installed on the right side of the column. In that position, all it might block would be the low end of the tach and perhaps the unused redline area' the important top half of the tach would be unobstructed. But after seeing photos of the gauge installed on XTs (on the left side instead of the right), I asked about obstruction and was assured by a Subaru dealer rep in another forum (who actually had received an XT with the boost gauge), that it didn't block the fuel or temp gauges at all. I didn't see how that would be possible, but took her at her word. I certainly hope it's possible without too much difficulty to reposition the gauge on the right side.
"This is a minor complaint, mind you, especially since it's just an option. But I like turbo boost gauges and I would pass on this one."
If the gauge can't be relocated to the right side and really does block the lower part of the fuel gauge (approaching empty), I'd put that a bit higher than a minor issue. Grrrrr.
forestergump says "Since the turbo boost gauge is mounted on the steering column, doesn't any obstruction it causes depend on how you have the wheel positioned? Or is the gauge positioned on the stationary portion of the steering column?"
The gauge installs forward of the steering wheel, on the fixed part of the column.
#441 of 476 which is my next Subaru?
Jun 20, 2003 (1:56 pm)
I have a '98 Outback limited with auto trans that I bought in the summer of '97. It has about 65,000 miles on it and runs great. I've had no problems with it and my only complaint is the lack of power. I think I made a mistake getting the auto trans. Oh well. Anyway I want something with more power and I'm sure I'll get a manual trans (I just hope I haven't forgot how to drive one in the last six years!). Should I get a turbo Forester or wait for a more powerful Outback? How much smaller is the current Forester than an older Outback? I'm a bit worried about that. Driving my Outback daily makes me feel like it isn't big and I wouldn't want to go smaller. My kids are 6 and 3, but most of the family trips are in her mini van. This would be a daily driver but would need ample room for kids in back. I fear the leg room isn't enough since I put the driver's seat all the way back. When I bought my Outback the Forester just came out and I got in the rear seat and I was not impressed with the leg room-but that was six years ago and it may be different now. I'm also not sure about cargo room.....But the price is right and it's here now. I've heard the next Outback might have a 3.0 250 HP non turbo engine in a lighter car than the current Outback. Will there be a turbo Outback? Any thoughts on how a non turbo Outback would do performance wise against the turbo Forester? I tend to think a bigger engine Outback would cost at least several thousand more than a turbo Forester. The price of the turbo Forester, the performance one gets for the $, and maybe having just enough room makes it looks real nice. It sounds like the perfect little bit of everything car.
Jun 20, 2003 (2:45 pm)
just what is "negative" boost anyway, are we talking a vacuum reading? The turbo can be applying "boost" in the sense that the vacuum readings aren't as negative as the NA engine at the same throttle position. End result: more fuel consumption. Although, I am thinking of it in terms of a normal carburator. The fuel injection may be tied into the pedal postion, not the vacuum readings. Too complex to speculate. We need a real subie tech to jump on the subject. On a practical side, so far we have been hearing mpg ratings similar to the EPA numbers.
Jun 20, 2003 (3:02 pm)
to change the discussion name.
HOST...the new name , my suggestion:
Forester XT: smoke 'em if you got 'em!
Jun 20, 2003 (3:08 pm)
John: The turbo gauge is really a manifold vacuum gauge. I believe a "negative" reading can still be had with the turbo running so you're right -- it'll probably show less negative pressure compared to a NA engine.
Jack: A lot of WRX owners have installed Defi gauges instead of the stock one. The stock gauge uses MPa units where as the Defi displays psi.
#445 of 476 Forester backseat room
Jun 20, 2003 (4:12 pm)
SteveSatch says, "When I bought my Outback the Forester just came out and I got in the rear seat and I was not impressed with the leg room-but that was six years ago and it may be different now."
I'd like to tell you it's a lot better, but...
The 2nd generation Foresters ('03-on) are claimed to have approximately an inch more backseat kneeroom. It's still very tight back there if, as you say, you need the front seat all the way back. You can improve the rear situation a bit by adjusting the driver's seat higher vertically (because that raises the angled seatback straight up); at the maximum height setting, things in back aren't quite so tight. This works OK if you don't have the sunroof; otherwise, headroom becomes an issue.
The Forester would be considerably improved (in my opinion) if the wheelbase (but not the overall length) was lengthened by about 2", with the entire increase plugged into the rear doors and backseat kneeroom. This would (by moving the backseat rearward) sacrifice about 1 cu.ft of rear cargo area with the seats up, but none with the seat folded.
#446 of 476 Hii, yo, Silver, awaaaay...
Jun 20, 2003 (4:16 pm)
My dealer just phoned. My silver 5-speed was just unloaded from the truck. I'm headed his way to see it. Unfortunately, they only do delivery preps on weekdays, so I can't actually get it until Monday! Grrrrr.