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BMW 3 Series, Sedan, Wagon
#11105 of 11917 Need advise on Demo 328xi
Aug 18, 2010 (6:37 pm)
Can you please advise on some demos I am looking at?
1. Are demos (2010 with 7.5K miles) safe to buy? Are there any things that I should ask to verify, considering there is no title or carfax, can I assume that demos would not have had any accident etc?
2. I have a quote $34,985 on 2010 328xi demo with 7.5K miles on it - comes with Premium Pkg., Value Pkg, Comfort Access, Heated Steering Wheel, iPod Adaptor.
Is that a good price? Is there room for me to negotiate??
#11106 of 11917 Re: 2007 Certified Preowned 328xi NJ Area [edwardsf]
Aug 18, 2010 (7:08 pm)
He was talking about the '06 330xi
#11107 of 11917 Re: 2007 Certified Preowned 328xi NJ Area [nyccarguy]
Aug 18, 2010 (7:53 pm)
Actually, there were a few numbers flying around. I priced out an '07 328 wagon, I believe an '07 328x wagon, and then there was the '06 330xi.
Thing about that particular '06 is that it has very low miles. When you are dealing with luxo cars, the miles make a BIG difference on the value. So that car was actually ~$20k.
#11108 of 11917 Re: Please help!!!!!!!! [nyccarguy]
Aug 18, 2010 (7:29 pm)
I appreciate the pointers...Just for kicks, I inquired about a trade-in for that car at another dealership; I was given a range of 19500-21500...Maybe I'll haggle a bit. After all, dealers are not moving too many CPOs in these rough economic times. I'll throw 19k at them and see how they react...Thanks again.
CPO(exp 09/12--100k miles) 2006 330 XI 32k miles, NAVIGATION, HEATED SEATS, SUNROOF, XENON LIGHTS, CD CHANGER, BLUETOOTH, 18 " WHEELS.... All packages...
#11109 of 11917 Re: 2007 Certified Preowned 328xi NJ Area [edwardsf]
Aug 18, 2010 (7:50 pm)
I'm not in car sales. Just a very experienced consumer. Anybody can subscribe to Galves, by the way.
Like you, I used to be angered by the secret book thing, But then I learned, in the end, what matters is that you are playing on the same field. When dealing with a trade-in, it is all about the difference. Comparing, let's say, KBB to Galves on a particular imaginary car, KBB is $2k more on the trade-in, but also $2k more on the retail side. If a buyer is willing to pay KBB retail, a dealer SHOULD be willing to pay KBB trade-in for the car being traded. And sometimes that happens.
What happens most times, of course, is that a dealer wants to pay Galves (or whatever secret book they are using in their region) but wants to charge KBB. This is where buyers get screwed.
Importantly, though, when NOT dealing with a trade-in, an educated buyer should be basing what they pay on the Galves number (or auction numbers if you can get them), not KBB or Edmunds or any other free service.
One story I've told around these boards before is from about 9 or 10 years ago. I did, in fact, know the Galves number for the car I was trading in as well as the one I wanted to buy. (By the way, I don't typically disclose the fact I know these numbers up front when negotiating.) The dealer comes back with the Galves number on my trade, but is not at all happy with my offer on their car ($2k over Galves). I then disclose I know the trade-in value of their car. He explains they don't use Galves when buying their cars, they use Black Book, and Black Book has a value about $1500 higher than Galves for the car they are selling.
Shortly after telling me this, the salesperson gets up to go check with the magic elves in the back office... and he leaves the Black Book on his desk. I'm not exactly shy, so I reach across, pick up the book, and start perusing. Well, just as I expected, the book was $1500 over on their car, BUT ALSO $1500 over on mine.
When he returned, I told him, "Hey, I have no problem paying $2k over Black Book on your car... as long as you give me Black Book value for my car."
I was shown the door pretty quickly after that.
#11111 of 11917 Re: Price [efrancisco]
Aug 18, 2010 (9:36 pm)
It's the Spam Monkey, "enfrancisco" AGAIN. Geez I wish that guy would take his lame link and disappear.
I expect that he is collecting a 1/10 of a cent for every poor soul that he can dupe into clicking on his link.
#11112 of 11917 Re: 2011 328xi - Advice on price [tax_atty]
Aug 19, 2010 (7:59 am)
Thank you. That helps a lot. Right now, my best offer on a 2011 328xi is ~$800 over invoice. Has anyone has been able to negotiate invoice on a 2011 328xi? Want to know if that is even achievable. Thanks.
#11113 of 11917 Re: 2011 328xi - Advice on price [audiorbmw]
Aug 19, 2010 (10:39 am)
I was able to get a 2011 335i xDrive with all prices quoted at invoice. With the $1,840 Option Credit and $750 dealer profit, the net even after Destination, registration, doc fees, etc was still under invoice. I got mine in June. My dealership is in Sudbury, MA.
#11114 of 11917 Re: 2007 Certified Preowned 328xi NJ Area [qbrozen]
Aug 19, 2010 (11:58 am)
Well, that scenario is indeed the point. The dealer will try to use any tool (especially a non-transparent one) that he has to lower the price of trade-ins and raise the price of his merchandise. Indeed, Galves markets to that approach by providing the dealer with some "authority" to do so.
Same with the Black Book. Especially the Black Book! I could give a hairy rat's behind what the auctioneer netted. What I want to get is the highest trade-in and lowest sale price that other similarly situated buyers are getting. KBB and Edmunds TMV are not perfect at that - this forum is much much better. But for your average Joe, KBB and TMV are much better tools than just jousting with a salesman's claims. And if you just go in and routinely offer $3-5000 below those numbers, you will often get it.
Since 99.9% of consumers don't have those secret code books, I think they are a hindrance to consumers because they limit information to one side of the negotiation. (No "invisible hand" there....) While I appreciate your clever use of those books, I think overall, they are a dealer's tool and should be exposed as such and not given some kind of due deference.