Honda Pilot Maintenance and Repair

Replying to: kipk (Aug 20, 2008 12:50 pm)

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• kipk (Oct 13, 2008 4:47 am)
  • mercara (Oct 13, 2008 5:10 pm)
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Replying to: strokeoluck2 (Oct 12, 2008 6:53 pm)

>"I'm sure there are still dealers that are operating with a "the customer is a rube" philosophy. But I think they're a dying breed. "
 
That would be great!
 
With the "Near" deal I described above, I had used Edmunds to "Build the car" and submitted it, through Edmunds, to dealers in my area. The dealers with "Internet Sales" . I picked the lowest bid and went there after corresponding with them via computer and phone.
 
The price I had from them held true. No problem there.
 
The problem developed when it came to my trade. Keep in mind that we may tend to add a lot of sentimental value to our cars before trading them. They may not be worth nearly so much to the dealer as they are to us, in our minds.
 
In my case: Late summer of 07. With the exception of fuel, washing, and driving, everything that had been done to the Pilot was done at a Honda dealer, under the "Severe Service" schedule, As most trips are under 10 miles. Oil was changed at 3700 mile intervals which is about every 6 months or so. So all this was verifiable. The Pilot had 27K miles on the odometer.
 
Before starting Trade negotiations, I had the Internet manager look over my Pilot. He found no door dings, paint flaws or interior flaws. The tires were still in beautiful condition, and there was 43,000 mile and 30+ months remaining on the "HONDA CARE" 7/70 extended warranty. Total mileage was low 27Ks. He admitted, it was one of those rare cars that actually fell into the "Excellent" category. They didn't even need to detail it, as I already had.
 
I had used Kelly Blue Book, Edmunds, and NADA to settle on a "TRADE IN" price.
That price is approximately $3K less than "Dealer Selling " price. And about $2K less than Private Party Price. So I was being as realistic as possible.
 
All the negotiations, we did, showed the price of the new vehicle remaining constant. So I had no problem there. Problem was with them attempting to steal my car.
 
However, when the General Manager (GM) got involved, the price on my used car went to within a couple of hundred of what I expected. I was tired and ready to take that, until I noticed that the new car price had somehow creeped up about $900.
When I questioned that, the GM said some "Add ON" items were on the new one that were not on the window. I said, "Your prices came out of your book, not off the window. What are the $900 worth of items." She couldn't answer and seemed agitated. I left.
 
When a car is traded in, there are two people to deal with. The NEW Car Manager and the USED car manager. They are two separate departments. BOTH trying to make as much profit as possible.
 
Example: USED car department tells the NEW car folks they will pay $8K for the trade, that might actually be worth say $!0k.
 
Your salesman tells you, your trade will bring $6k today as they need your car. If this happens, the used car guy pays the new car guy the $8K and the new car guy has just made $2k on your trade, plus profit on the new one. The used car guy payed $2K under true value. Everybody at the dealership is happy!
 
If you hang tough, they will use that $2k wiggle room to negotiate a few hundred dollars at a time. If you are real tough, they might go back to the used car guy for more money. He was really able to pay more than the $8K, but why should he, if the new car guy will take the $8k.? FWIW they "deal" with each other also. Now, the NEW car guy might even get on the phone and "Shop your trade, if the USED car guy won't do better. Remember you trade is actually worth $10K as a trade. They can make a good profit on your car by giving you the $10K and selling it at the Retail value. BUT if they can make more money , they will.
 
The more profit they make, the more each involved person makes in commissions. PERIOD! That is how they make their living. The customer foots the bill. They do this every day and are Professionals at what they do. We do this every few years and don't have a clue what is going on each time our salesman goes back and forth to the "Tower" or "Room" trying to make the deal.
 
Buyer beware ! Confirm the selling price of the car you are buying. Arrange financing before you go to the dealer. Often times the dealer will match or better your financing if they HAVE too. BE REALISTIC ABOUT THE TRUE VALUE OF YOUR TRADE AHEAD OF TIME. DON'T LET EMOTIONS COST YOU. YOU MIGHT HEAR SOMETHING LIKE, "WHY THAT IS ONLY $42 A MONTH MORE THAN YOU HAD PLANNED ON. ARE YOU GOING TO LET $42 KEEP YOU OUT OF THE CAR YOU WANT". Keep in mind that little $42 a month is $3,000 over 72 months.
 
Kip

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• mercara (Oct 13, 2008 5:10 pm)
  • kipk (Oct 16, 2008 3:19 am)
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Replying to: kipk (Oct 13, 2008 4:47 am)

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Replying to: pilotvic (Jun 09, 2008 6:39 pm)

Ok, so I've been to the dealership about 5 times to take care of the "thump". They replaced the rubber feet on the hatch, they adjusted the hatch, adjusted the locking mechanism and even added some temporary tape to the locking mechanism and the noise it's still there. The service rep said that it could be the gas shocks on the hatch but the noise still persist!! The service manager got involved and involved Honda and both came up empty handed. If there's no breakthrough ideas from the dealership, Honda or my fellow forum members I'll be trading it in for a Mazda CX-9 or a Subaru Tribeca... Any suggestions out there?!?!
Thanx!

Replying to: mercara (Oct 13, 2008 5:10 pm)

">Seems like you had a lot of life left in your 03 pilot under warranty. Why wouldn't you just keep it? "
 
mercara,
 
Excellent question! In hindsight, I agree with you 100%.
 
(Stupid as it seems now) Here is how it went down:
 
My next door neighbor decided he wanted to try camping. My family spent several years camping, and memories of those wonderful times still linger. So I was eager to help. I'm retired so I really don't have many "Have to do Things"!
 
He needed two things. A camper and something to pull it with. He decided on a light weight hard sided camper that would fold or telescope for easier towing and better fuel mileage. Choices were a Hi-LO or a Trail Manor. He decided on the Trail Manor. Not my choice, but he is spending the money! Then we spent the better part of the '07 summer driving and comparing every type of truck made.
(Meanwhile, I was starting to really want another camper again.)
 
Eventually I talked him into driving a Ridgeline. Honda was having some serious incentives and he bought a $29K Ridgeline, ready to tow, for something like $23,500.
 
In my mind I had decided to seriously consider one of the makes of fiberglass "Egg" campers. Light weight, easy to tow with a even a small car, shaped like an Air Stream, and plenty of room for me and the wife to camp for a week at a time. The Pilot would easily tow it, as it only weighs 1300-2000 pounds.
Needed to get the 7 pin electrical connector that would charge the camper battery and operate the camper electric brake. Well guess what! Not available through Honda. The Ridgeline has it. But not the Pilot. Went to a respected Hitch house. They said they could do it, but had never actually done it before. That got scary!
 
So my mind turned to the Ridgeline. My neighbor's was towing his Trail Manor with ease. And I was on a roll! Thank goodness, the dealer trying to steal my Pilot, brought me back to my senses.
 
This Pilot is a wonderful vehicle, and does everything we need. If I drive it for pure economy, at 60 MPH with little to no AC, it will return 26+ MPG. At 70 with full AC, it returns 23-24 MPG. If I need to haul something, that won't fit inside or on top, I have a utility trailer.
 
Thanks,
Kip

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• mercara (Oct 17, 2008 6:37 pm)
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Replying to: kipk (Oct 16, 2008 3:19 am)

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• kipk (Oct 18, 2008 4:04 am)

Replying to: mercara (Oct 17, 2008 6:37 pm)

Even the 03 models were rated to tow a 4500# boat or low trailer. But limited to a 3500# trailer with a flat tall front, such as a square type camper or utility trailer, that would have a lot of wind resistance. I got no problem with that.
 
Where I have the problem is with the fact that they don't give me the option of towing something with electric brakes. The only choice Pilot owners have had is "surge" brakes. Surge brakes work fairly well, but are "Re-active" . When the tow vehicle slows quickly enough, the trailer pushes against it's hitch/coupler and hydraulics apply the trailer brakes.
 
If backing up a hill, over a curb, and such, the surge trailer brake may activate because the hitch is being compressed, just as it would be if braking while going forward.
This requires getting the pressure off the coupler and inserting a pin to keep the coupler from compressing. Need to remember to remove the pin before getting back on the road. Electric brakes only operate when getting an electrical signal from the tow vehicle or driver.
 
Electric brakes, if properly set up, will apply a slight amount of brake to the trailer before the tow vehicle begins to brake. This really helps to avoid "Jack Knifes", and can even correct swaying when going down long steep grades in the mountains. Or swaying due to a passing 18 wheeler or heavy cross winds. Electric brake controlers have a lever that can be operated by hand that will apply trailer brakes "only" if need be.
 
I've dealt with both types over the years and they each have their place.
Just pisses me off, me that Toyota, Nissan, GM, Ford, and Chrysler all offer the 7 pin connector with their tow packages, but Honda does not.
 
Possibly the 09 Pilots, with the integrated Class 3 hitch, do!
 
Rant over!
 
Kip

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Replying to: mitch65 (Oct 24, 2008 12:46 pm)

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Replying to: mitch65 (Oct 24, 2008 12:46 pm)