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#17481 of 19336 Re: '08 outback issues [gaucho1]
Nov 28, 2007 (4:44 pm)
1. Mileage on today's Subarus isn't worth a damn. They might as well be made in Detroit. (I had a 1987 Subaru wagon that clocked a consistent 30mpg city, and 32 mpg highway, for 465,000 miles before I reluctantly retired it.) My 2006 Subaru is lucky to make 25 mpg under the exact same conditions.)
In 1987 your Subaru wagon weighed significantly less, had almost no safety features, had 90hp or 115hp and was NOT AWD. It was FWD with part-time 4wd at best. So let's compare apples to apples.
2. Turbo systems on small engines are an additional complication. Any benefit(?) of short-duration power will be offset by reduced mileage, hotter cylinder temps and increased wear and tear. Toss in the additional sensors and decision-table programming, and its not a good thing, financially. Suggestion: Let someone else be the beta tester. Buy one only after the fix is known; and applied. Maybe in another ten years.
I'm not sure I follow. I road race a completely stock 1994 Legacy Turbo with 150k street miles and about 10-15k track miles. We are talking at or near redline for 1hr+ sessions. I also track my 05 LGT Wagon which has a turbo and neither has blown up or had decreased life spans (which on most cars is about 150-175k miles these days) Subaru has been making turbo cars for a long time, so it's not like you are a beta tester in any size shape or form.
5. Spin-out: The AWD system will keep this to a minimum. However, if you do break traction, the AWD will go bananas attempting to recover. Compound this situation with the added (over-steer) input of a frantic driver attempting to counter-steer, and the ABS being applied (equally frantically), and you'll *never* regain control before you hit something! (Don't ask how I know this...) In retrospect, your best bet is to let go of the steering wheel, hit the brakes solid, and pray.
Again, you are driving this car like it's the 70s and 80s. In today's world, with VDC, Traction Control and ABS, if you simply apply the brakes or gas and steer where you want to go, the AWD system will apply the power to the wheels that grip. Perhaps a snow/low traction driving course with ABS/AWD/TractionControl cars is in order?
Overall the turbo won't kill your milage if you don't drive it hard all the time. I get consistently 19mpg with my LGT in the city/commuting but I'm running wider, stickier tires than stock, and I push it through the corners and on/off ramps constantly. When I had normal tires I was getting 23mpg in city/commute and 26-27 at 75 on the highway.
#17482 of 19336 Re: '08 outback issues [gaucho1]
Nov 28, 2007 (4:50 pm)
5. Spin-out: The AWD system will keep this to a minimum. However, if you do break traction, the AWD will go bananas attempting to recover. Compound this situation with the added (over-steer) input of a frantic driver attempting to counter-steer, and the ABS being applied (equally frantically), and you'll *never* regain control before you hit something! (Don't ask how I know this...) In retrospect, your best bet is to let go of the steering wheel, hit the brakes solid, and pray
I respectfully disagree.
Fresh snow/ice here, and I just took my almost 16-year old son out for a little driving practice. Smooth & gentle applications of both accelerator and brake, steering through a problem with the ABS engaged (you CAN steer with the ABS in full-on mode), and pointing the front wheels in the direction you want to go with a smooth gentle application of power... all those attributes certainly beat the 'let go of the steering wheel' mentality. At least that's what I'm trying to teach my son.
#17483 of 19336 Re: '08 outback issues [hammerhead]
Nov 28, 2007 (4:55 pm)
Paul to follow that up, you should teach him a bit about powering through a skid with AWD. If you are completely off the accelerator, the AWD system cannot and will not re-distribute power to various wheels and axles. In order to force the AWD system to do it's work, a lightly applied throttle will allow it to sense slippage and grip and transfer the power.
In racing, I've had an "off" on more occasions than I care to remember which puts you from very sticky asphalt to grass/dirt/snow/mud/etc and on both my 1994 Legacy Race car as well as my 2005 LGT Wagon, lightly applying power allowed me to grip and continue in the direction of movement and gently come back on track w/o a problem. In fact recently, a fellow instructor in a camaro following me when I went off saw it was me with AWD and left me enough room to come back ontrack, he talked to me afterward saying I knew you'd come right back on track cause you have the AWD and kept your foot in it.
#17484 of 19336 Re: '08 outback issues [paisan]
Nov 28, 2007 (5:08 pm)
Mike - we did exactly that this afternoon... although the MT doesn't sense & adjust, it still 'powers through' & pulls in the intended direction. We tried it both ways, and he was able to see the obvious differences. (emphasis on the light throttle)
Forecast here calls for up to 6 inches of snow through tomorrow, so we'll probably have more opportunities for practice. He's done with driver's ed, has had lots of fair-weather practice, but needs the work on the slippery.
#17485 of 19336 Re: '08 outback issues [hammerhead]
Nov 28, 2007 (5:14 pm)
On my MTs (both my LGT and the Race car) while the power won't adjust to an individual wheel it will move it front to back based on traction.
#17486 of 19336 Re: '08 outback issues [paisan]
Nov 28, 2007 (5:43 pm)
I thought (I could be wrong) that the 90's manuals were a constant 50/50 front/rear split... to my mind that's an advantage of the MT over the automatics. After driving it for 6 years, I've become accustomed to the feel.
Nov 28, 2007 (8:23 pm)
After 1.5 hours of work, I have the timing belt starring me in the face. In the morning when there is more light I will take some pictures and post them.
The marks are the belt are shifted to the right by one tooth from the marks on the sprockets. I am going to check it again when there is more light. I will mark the belt then align the marks according to the service manual. Then run the engine.
#17488 of 19336 Re: '08 outback issues [paisan]
Nov 29, 2007 (7:13 am)
My Forester was fun in those conditions.
Basically in a turn while on the throttle, you could get the rear end to break loose. But when it did, power shifts to the front axle and it pulls you out of the skid.
It was amazingly controllable, and repeatable. Just stay in the throttle, smoothly.
If you get REAL good at it, you can then slide the tail out in the other direction, and catch that skid, too.
Disclaimer: this was done in an empty parking lot. Make sure it's really empty!
#17489 of 19336 Re: Cargo cover [opusman]
Nov 29, 2007 (10:40 am)
I too have a 2000 outback whose retractable cargo cover will no longer retract, and was told by the dealer that all i could do was buy a new one, seems ridiculous. Any ideas for a fix?????!!!!!!