- #5927 of 6205
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G35XS nav/prem/sport - Help me backwork these numbers!
by bcarter610
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May 13, 2008 (8:40 pm)
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I'm about two weeks out from buying a 2008 G35xS - nav/premium/sports packages. I've had a bidding war for a little bit now between two dealers and I've received - what I believe is going to be - the winning quote for the ladder G35xS (MSRP's at $40.825)
The initial quote I received from the dealer was for the following:
"Total out of pocket $3000. 12k/yr $443./mo NJ tax included for 39mo term for vehicle that has msrp of $40,825. selling for $37000..." (Infiniti of Willow Grove - PA)
After a small bidding war, this same dealer (Infiniti of Willow Grove - PA) came back on top, but the numbers are now:
"Assuming NJ taxes, $3000 due  delivery, $435./mo. is the absolute best we can do on a vehicle that we have in stock..."
My question is: How can I "backwork" the numbers so that I can be sure that a new quote (for a 24 month lease) only changes in terms of residual and money factor? (I believe the dealer is using May's leasing rates)
--> The reason I ask is because I've decided to go with a 24 month lease, but before this dealer reworks the numbers, I want to make sure they use the same cap. cost as they did for the 36month lease.
Any help with this would be greatly appreciated! I'm anxious to get my hands on this car XD !!!
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- #5928 of 6205
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Re: G35XS nav/prem/sport - Help me backwork these numbers! [bcarter610]
by brodway
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May 13, 2008 (9:02 pm)
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Replying to: bcarter610 (May 13, 2008 8:40 pm)
Seems like the residual numbers in your post are different than what was posted here in early May. Wondering which are the correct numbers.
As far as going back and trying to figure out the actual selling price of the vehicle you have in mind, it would be helpful to know what the $3000 down payment includes. If part of the $3000 is the acquisition fee, doc fee, motor vehicle fee and upfront sales tax it is one thing, but if you are putting the $3000 as a cap cost reduction, it would yield completely different figures.
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- #5929 of 6205
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Re: G35XS nav/prem/sport - Help me backwork these numbers! [bcarter610]
by brodway
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May 13, 2008 (9:25 pm)
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Replying to: bcarter610 (May 13, 2008 8:40 pm)
Putting in the numbers you provided and using usual NJ fees of $595 acquisition fee, $249 doc fee, $400 motor vehicle fees, $7.50 NJ Tire Fee you are being quoted about $1000 over invoice. I don't think this is a great deal and putting $3000 down is silly, when you can put down the same $3000 towards refundable multiplie security deposits and bringing down your rate instead.
Total out of pocket $3000. 12k/yr $443./mo NJ tax included for 39mo term for vehicle that has msrp of $40,825. selling for $37000..." (Infiniti of Willow Grove - PA)
After a small bidding war, this same dealer (Infiniti of Willow Grove - PA) came back on top, but the numbers are now:
"Assuming NJ taxes, $3000 due delivery, $435./mo. is the absolute best we can do on a vehicle that we have in stock..."
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- #5930 of 6205
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Re: G35XS nav/prem/sport - Help me backwork these numbers! [bcarter610]
by brodway
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May 13, 2008 (9:34 pm)
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Replying to: bcarter610 (May 13, 2008 8:40 pm)
Using the MSRP price of 40825 and selling price of 37000 with a residual of 60% on 12k miles over 39 month, with 0 down, rolling in the assumed 595 acquisition fee, 400 motor vehicle fee, 249 doc fee and $7.50 tire fee and putting up 9 refundable multiple security deposits bringing the money factor down to .00082, your monthly payment should be $432. Again this is with nothing down and a refundable amount of $3888 that you will get back at the end of the lease.
I think this is the way to go versus handing them the $3000 and having nothing to show for it if your car ever gets totalled or stolen. Plus you get the $3888 back when you bring the car in after the 39 months. Instead of you giving them $3000 and never seeing it again, they pay you back $3888 and you save $3 per month.
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- #5931 of 6205
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Re: G35XS nav/prem/sport - Help me backwork these numbers! [brodway]
by bcarter610
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May 14, 2008 (6:25 am)
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Replying to: brodway (May 13, 2008 9:02 pm)
I guess I should clarify... The $3,000 is the total amount due at signing, and the 435/m is including NJ taxes. Does this help?
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- #5932 of 6205
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brodway....i'm intrigued
by drjustin
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May 14, 2008 (8:09 am)
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and totally lost at the same time. could you please help explain the "multiple (9) security deposit's"
does this mean that he is putting up $3000 in deposit's he'll get back later? rather than making a capitalization reduction in the amount of $3k? so he puts up $3000 now, and gets interest in the amount of $888 after 39/mo?
where is the incentive for the dealer? do they make additional interest money on the 3k? or am i simply just too discombobulated?
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- #5933 of 6205
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Re: brodway....i'm intrigued [drjustin]
by brodway
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May 14, 2008 (8:38 am)
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Replying to: drjustin (May 14, 2008 8:09 am)
Yes the multipe security deposits work differently than a reduction in the capitalization of the vehicle. With a cap cost reduction you are putting up money to reduce your monthly payments. To me that is the same thing as paying more for the vehilce. One of the options available at least in NJ (and this may not be applicable in all states), is that you have the option of reducing your money factor by .0001 points for every payment you put up as security. This is refundable to you at the end of the lease. In essence if for example your money factor is .00150, by putting down 9 deposits up front (this is the maximum), you lower your money factor to .00060. By doing the interest rate you are paying on the vehicle for the life of the lease goes from 3.6% down to 1.44%. This obviously reduces your monthly payment and your money is redunded at the end of the lease.
I don't think there is any advantage to the dealer, but there is an advantage to Infiniti. First, they get to use your money for 2 or 3 years and you have to consider that there is a cost of capital. Second, if you wind up not meeting your obligation of the lease, and lets say default on the lease, they get to keep your security deposit.
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- #5934 of 6205
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Re: New G35 in CA (Bay Area) [partzguy]
by osodeoro
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May 14, 2008 (8:45 am)
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Replying to: partzguy (May 12, 2008 7:27 pm)
Don, part skill, part luck, I guess. The luck part- the 3 Infiniti dealers (Oakland, Concord and Pleasanton) within a half hour drive. So they are pretty competitive. I did lots of research (here and elsewhere), test drives, etc. to determine what I wanted before I started the negotiation process. Once I new what I wanted, I sent them all requests for offers through Edmunds and heard back from them all within a day. The internet sales guys cut to the chase pretty quickly, and I was down around invoice from two of them in no time. Then I waited until the last day of the month and whittled it down a bit more and pulled the trigger.
Oakland seems to be the most aggressive, with Pleasanton willing to keep up with them. The Concord guy was very helpful, but in the end wouldn't work down on price like the other two.
Hope this helps and good luck!
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- #5935 of 6205
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Re: G35XS nav/prem/sport - Help me backwork these numbers! [bcarter610]
by brodway
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May 14, 2008 (8:47 am)
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Replying to: bcarter610 (May 14, 2008 6:25 am)
Again you are not specifying what the $3000 covers. Is it for fees that are associated with the cost of the initiation of the lease or are they taking the $3000 and putting it in their pocket, which to me is the same thing as you are now paying $40,0000 for the car and not $37,000. You can call it due at signing, origination cost, upfront cost, application cost or what ever else, but at the end of the day where does that money go. To reiterate in NJ, your total out of pocket costs should only consist of Acquisition fee of $595 which is mandatory to pay by Infiniti, motor vehicle fees which are dictated by the NJ motor vehicle commission and depending on how long you are registering the vehicle (2, 3, 4 years), Documentation Fee which all dealers charge (its another way of making money and tacking on a cost with a fancy name, but there is nothing you can do about it other than try to find someone who has a fee of no more than $250 or so), NJ Tire fee of $7.50. All these costs together should run about $1200. So by you putting up $3,000 instead there is $1,800 going somewhere that is not clear. It could only mean one thing. The $1,800 is going towards the reduction in the cap cost of the vehicle, which translates to a real cost of the car of $38,800 and not $37,000 you are stating.
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- #5936 of 6205
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Re: G35x - Good Deal? [brodway]
by mpkrasner
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May 14, 2008 (12:32 pm)
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Replying to: brodway (May 13, 2008 8:16 pm)
I'm looking to get the 36 month lease. According to what I've read in this discussion thread, I thought $450 above invoice was a good price. I'm not sure how the "incentive" or "upfront" cost is over since it only incorporates the first month's payment ($489), bank fee ($595), motor vehicle fee ($375), NJ state tire tax ($7.50), upfront taxes ($55.58) and doc fee ($199), which equals $1721.08.
If the deal is $450 over invoice, then by my numbers the net cap cost would be $37235 for a car with an MSRP of $40175 and an invoice of $36785 with a monthly payment of $521.07 and an upfront cost of $1232 w/o the first month's payment or $1722 with the first month's payment.
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