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Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

16087 messages,  Last post on May 09, 2013 at 9:32 AM

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What is this discussion about? BMW 3 Series, Infiniti G37, Acura TL, Lexus IS 350, Mercedes-Benz C-Class, Cadillac CTS, Volvo S60, Audi A4, Acura TSX, Car Comparisons, Sedan

Messages Page 845 of 1610

#8436 of 16087 Still... by plekto

Mar 05, 2007 (12:08 am)

Have you ever thought that maybe, just maybe, BMW is gouging a TAD for that image? I mean, there's just no way a Porsche SUV is worth what they charge, either, yet they seem to have no problem jacking up the price because of that little logo on the hood.
 
The current CTS is already better than the 525i, so something's just not right considering the price difference alone.
 
Trust me. The 2008 CTS will be better than the 5 series for a lot less money. Shoot, the 5 and 7 series aren't as good as some of the Japanese competitors, either. The 3 - yeah, it's a rocket and worth the money, but the 5 and 7 need some serious updating and vision because the competition is coming for them with both all blazing.
 
2007 CTS 3.6l. 6.6 Seconds 15.0 quarter mile
1993 Porsche 968 6.6 Seconds 14.9 quarter mile
2007 525i 7.3 Seconds 16.7 quarter mile
2007 530i 6.6 Seconds 14.7 quarter mile
 
BMW's got very little breathing room in 2008 by the looks of it

#8437 of 16087 Re: Still... [plekto] by habitat1

Mar 05, 2007 (3:01 am)

Replying to: plekto (Mar 05, 2007 12:08 am)
"BMW's got very little breathing room in 2008 by the looks of it"
 
By the looks of it, your postings of 0-60 and quarter mile times shows that you've got very little clue as to what driving dynamics are all about and why BMW has little to worry about from GM. And if you are simply trying to win stop light drag races, you can do a boatload better than a CTS which depreciates to half its value in about the time it takes to complete that quarter mile.
 
P.S.
 
Porsche Cayenne S: 6.4 seconds; 14.6 quarter mile
Porsche Cayenne Turbo: 4.9 seconds; 13.2 quarter mile

#8438 of 16087 Coming to a dealer near you this spring... by shipo

Mar 05, 2007 (4:30 am)

2008 528i zero to sixty: 6.5 Seconds
2008 535i zero to sixty: 5.5 Seconds
 
Just keeping things up to date.
 
Oh, and superior driving dynamics compared to a CTS? That my friends is in the base suspension. Add the Sport Package and things get even better.
 
Best Regards,
Shipo

#8439 of 16087 Re: Still... [habitat1] by nkeen

Mar 05, 2007 (5:36 am)

Replying to: habitat1 (Mar 05, 2007 3:01 am)
Ah, but the Cayenne is neither car nor Porsche.

#8440 of 16087 Re: Coming to a dealer near you this spring... [shipo] by markcincinnati

Mar 05, 2007 (6:16 am)

Replying to: shipo (Mar 05, 2007 4:30 am)
Did I miss something?
 
Since when did the BMW 5 become a member of the ELLPS class? Has it somehow fallen out of favor as an LPS member?
 
Or, somehow, has the rumor and speculation about the new CTS allowed it to join the LPS class before it is even reviewed?
 
If we're going to talk about wheelbase, cubic this thats and the other thing, why isn't there mention of similarly sized cars from Hyundai? That spanky top o' the line model is, after all, comparable to a BMW 7 (in size). It says so in all the adverts.
 
Spent wheel time again this weekend in a 2007 Chrysler 300 AWD "Limited." Lovely car, great MSRP, considering it has "a lot" if not almost all the amenities that come in the ELLPS and/or LPS class.
 
Yet I get out of a 2007 300 with 1,000 miles on the OD into a 2005 Audi A6 with 30,000+ miles on it, and the Audi feels newer, tighter, more controlled, refined, smooth, etc. The 300 seems somehow looser, not quite as precise in its steering, a little bit unrefined and floaty at speeds over 65. But with a nice long wheelbase, good leather, a decent stereo with Sirius Radio, and power pedals even -- what a lot of car for the money. Heck it has ESP and some fine Mercedes underwear. Upgraded 18" wheels and tires round out the package as do easily modulated and smooth four corner disk brakes.
 
For the money, apparently, nothing even comes close -- but for pity's sake, it isn't in the same class as the other LPS cars (or even some of these ELLPS cars.)
 
The current CTS (also a car that I've driven extensively) is very competent and nearly as tight as the "real" LPS cars. But, to keep comparing cars based soley on wheelbase or 0-60 times or cubic hectares per fortnight seems (to me) to miss the point.
 
Shipo, the question stands, did the 5 series somehow fall from grace? Could the new CTS, not even out yet, already be the newest LPS?

#8441 of 16087 Re: Still... [nkeen] by habitat1

Mar 05, 2007 (6:16 am)

Replying to: nkeen (Mar 05, 2007 5:36 am)
Right...and wrong

#8442 of 16087 Re: Coming to a dealer near you this spring... [markcincinnati] by shipo

Mar 05, 2007 (7:00 am)

Replying to: markcincinnati (Mar 05, 2007 6:16 am)
No worries Mark, I was just responding to some marginally accurate statements regarding the acceleration of the current (and very soon to be discontinued) 525i and 530i.
 
As far as I know, the 5-Series is still and will continue to be one of the benchmark holders of the LPS class of cars.
 
Oh, and the CTS? Even with the impending new model, I trust it will continue to be an also-ran in the ELLPS category.
 
Best Regards,
Shipo

#8443 of 16087 Re: Coming to a dealer near you this spring... [shipo] by circlew

Mar 05, 2007 (9:04 am)

Replying to: shipo (Mar 05, 2007 7:00 am)
To elaborate on the Caddy representing this segment, the true test of even staying on the list in this forum is apparently more appropriate.
 
As usual, this US manufacturer is off the mark because the CTS tries to compete with too many models in different segments. I can't expect anything unique coming from the Catera family line. Hopefully, they kill it off soon.
 
It is up to the Host, of course, to decide that for this forum..
 
Regards,
OW

#8444 of 16087 Re: Coming to a dealer near you this spring... [shipo] by hauss

Mar 05, 2007 (9:50 am)

Replying to: shipo (Mar 05, 2007 4:30 am)
Can you even say those numbers are accurate when the cars aren't even coming off the assembly line yet?

#8445 of 16087 Re: Coming to a dealer near you this spring... [hauss] by shipo

Mar 05, 2007 (10:33 am)

Replying to: hauss (Mar 05, 2007 9:50 am)
"Can you even say those numbers are accurate when the cars aren't even coming off the assembly line yet?"
 
I could tell you how I know that, but then I'd have to kill you.
 
FWIW, I believe that the cars are now coming off the assembly line and will start appearing on our shores sometime between mid April and mid May. As for the times I posted, ummm, let's just say that BMW has a habit of being conservative with these numbers, and that the tests that'll start showing up in magazine in a month or two will most likely best these times.
 
Best Regards,
Shipo

Messages Page 845 of 1610

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