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Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

16251 messages,  Last post on Jun 18, 2013 at 7:02 AM

You are in the Sedans Forum.

What is this discussion about? BMW 3 Series, Infiniti G37, Acura TL, Lexus IS 350, Mercedes-Benz C-Class, Cadillac CTS, Volvo S60, Audi A4, Acura TSX, Car Comparisons, Sedan

Messages Page 1562 of 1626

#15604 of 16251 My pet peeve ... by dino001

Feb 05, 2013 (12:50 pm)

... is fold-down rear seat. I think for BMW or Benz to demand $500 for it on sedans is a true scandal and I'm shocked they are getting away with it. What's worse, many dealers actually do not order this option, so I can bet there are many trully surprised owners of 3-series, who discover their seats don't fold down first time they try to put something bigger into their trunk.
 
Xenons? Yeah, I think this is a disapointment that Germans charge extra for those. It should be standard today on ELLPS.
Leather seats? I'd agree that in US-market it is also a big disapointment that BMW or Benz demand almost two grand for that, but knowing a bit about Euro market, I can certify that Europeans at large do not revere leather uphostery nearly as much as Americans. Many straight out prefer high quality cloth over leather on both their home couch and their car. One could call it charitably a "cultural difference". MB Tex is reporteadly a very high quality material, both in terms of appearance and durability, so it is even preferred by many. Quick inventory browse shows it is a majority on C250 models, which seems to confirm that assertion. If they sell, they can't be so bad. I bet many people actually think it is leather (as it is faking it really well).
 
I don't know about BMW, their leatherette has much less footprint. It may mean the quality differential is greater. However, BMW also bundles leather with its premium package (MB does not), which is considered a must, even by selling dealers (BMW dealers actually order the cars they want within model allotments), plus it was even a free upgrade when E9x was being phased out (I know it was $0 option on my 2012 wagon).
 
Anyway, I remember, when I added sunroof and those fold-down seats to sedan, suddenly the wagon (where it was standard) was not more expensive, at all. Tells me a lot about the mindset and market. I guess it is their effort to expand the buyer's base to those "aspirational" purchasers (not just by leases, but also by playing with content level), whereas wagons, coupes and convertibles do not have to carry that burden.

#15605 of 16251 Re: Another ELLPS enters the ring.... [billyperksii] by flightnurse

Feb 05, 2013 (2:29 pm)

Replying to: billyperksii (Feb 05, 2013 7:30 am)
Yeah- try finding a base car on any dealer lot.
 
Phoenix Motor has 25 C250's that are under 39K... Half are 37.9K and under. I'm sure most have leather and 7 spd auto.
 
http://mercedesofphoenix.com/new-inventory?Make=Mercedes-Benz&Model=C-Class&sort- =Price%20asc
 
Granted they also have 56K C350 sport too... OUCH...

#15606 of 16251 Re: Another ELLPS enters the ring.... [flightnurse] by billyperksii

Feb 05, 2013 (3:09 pm)

Replying to: flightnurse (Feb 05, 2013 2:29 pm)
Good Luck to those purchasers of 37k C250- as another poster would say Happy Motoring.

#15607 of 16251 Re: Another ELLPS enters the ring.... [flightnurse] by dino001

Feb 05, 2013 (3:19 pm)

Replying to: flightnurse (Feb 05, 2013 2:29 pm)
It is impossible that those 37K-39K Benzes have leather. According to MBUSA.com, to add leather seats ($1750), you have add premium package ($2500), which means even without metallic color ($720), you have to add $4250 to sticker, i.e. price HAS TO cross 40 grand to get leather. The MBTex looks like leather, but it is not. Many dealers are just terrible in car descriptions on their websites. All they give you is price, colors and list of standard equipment, which they call "options", probably to confuse you. Or perhaps they don't undertand meaning of word "option". Assuming some low level secretary inputs the data, it is possible, I suppose. BMW, MB and Volvo dealers are worst when it comes to description of their stock. At least those from my neck of the woods. Surprisingly, Cadillac dealers show exact descriptions of their stock, including package/option codes and everything. The lower you go in brand, the better it gets. All Ford, Toyota, GM, websites are great when it comes to accurate stock description. Go figure.

#15608 of 16251 Re: Another ELLPS enters the ring.... [dino001] by sweendogy

Feb 05, 2013 (4:33 pm)

Replying to: dino001 (Feb 05, 2013 3:19 pm)
So msrps on Germans are misleading because you dk what exactly is in the said car. Interesting. I just went to the acura website- and they have 5 different ilx models - they come as they come no real options to speak just dealer accessories - same with the TL (6) and Tsx(5). Btw if the new mb 1 series is Ellps then so is the ilx.
Now I'm not an acura fan in its current state of bland but will say if they are Ellps ( and to me that's debatable) they have pricing and packaging down.

#15609 of 16251 Re: Another ELLPS enters the ring.... [dino001] by flightnurse

Feb 06, 2013 (1:04 pm)

Replying to: dino001 (Feb 05, 2013 3:19 pm)
Dino this is the description the dealer has for the less expensive C250 which is priced at $37,055. Is this internet price???
2013 C250 Sedan with Mars Red Exterior, Black MB-Tex Interior, Sport Package, 17'' 5-Twin Spoke Wheels, Becker MAP PILOT Navigation, Aluminum Trim, and Much More!!
 
Now we all know how dealers get people into the showroom, but if the description is correct, the car has sport package, but according to MBUSA webpage the sport package comes with 18" wheel and tires not 17..

#15610 of 16251 Relevant cars by tlong

Feb 06, 2013 (1:58 pm)

Do we need to change the list? I see Acura TL, TSX - if the TSX is the entry car, why is TL on the list? I see BMW 3 but not BMW 1. I see Caddy CTS but no ATS.

#15611 of 16251 Re: Relevant cars [tlong] by Kirstie@Edmunds HOST

Feb 06, 2013 (2:07 pm)

Replying to: tlong (Feb 06, 2013 1:58 pm)
There's a limit to the number of vehicles we can list. The current list represents vehicles that people search for most often on our site (or search for on Google and end up in forums).

#15612 of 16251 b8 S4 vs G37x vs GS350 vs random by bunit23

Feb 06, 2013 (2:48 pm)

I have this going one another forum and thought I would bring this to a more universal sight too.
  
I will be purchasing a car in the near future and I am going for CPO. I really want an AWD, so the S4 is my first choice. I heard the Quattro is sick. The car will mostly be used for Road trips and Weekend driving. I have a older Nissan Maxima that is my daily driver. My main issue with the Audi is that most people state that it will be costly and frequent, in the future, and I plan on keeping the car for a long time. My 96 Maxima currently has 171k on it.
  
I live in San Antonio Tx and it can get pretty hot. Are there any reasons I should avoid the Audi besides costly repairs??? I am not a wrencher, but I am not afraid to dig in.
  
I am open to other cars too
  
Please give me suggestions!!!
  
So far the cars that caught my eyes are:
  
Infiniti G37x (looks cheap in most areas, but still a great ride)
  
Lexus GS350 (Never owned a Toyota and this one seems pretty nice)
  
Audi B8 S4 (so far has all the specs I want and I like to have cars I don't see on the road all the time)
  
***BMW 335xi is not on my radar because I see way too many BMW's out here. I don't want to join the club.***

#15613 of 16251 Re: b8 S4 vs G37x vs GS350 vs random [bunit23] by nyccarguy

Feb 06, 2013 (3:11 pm)

Replying to: bunit23 (Feb 06, 2013 2:48 pm)
AWD in Texas?

Messages Page 1562 of 1626

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