Last post on Dec 12, 2013 at 7:09 AM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
BMW 3 Series, Infiniti G37, Acura TL, Lexus IS 350, Mercedes-Benz C-Class, Cadillac CTS, Volvo S60, Audi A4, Acura TSX, Car Comparisons, Sedan
Jan 29, 2013 (2:24 pm)
Priced MUCH HIGHER?
I would think if, to use made up but approximate numbers, that an Audi A4 or BMW 3 (something) can be "nicely contented," which I suspect means, these days, Premium Package, Premium Paint (and Infiniti doesn't, currently, charge for any color they offer), Nav Package, and Sport Package or Technology Package (but not both) for something between $45K and $49K -- depending on the "either or" packages and metallic paint, bla bla bla, that Infiniti would be -- even with this new presumably sexy Q50 -- hard pressed to come in at parity with the Germans.
I mean, really, my last A4 (a 2009) was $49K -- for $49K I'm going to stick with the German car. I wouldn't pay $49K for the G (or the new Q -- at least not until it is vetted by you all here on Edmunds and the motoring press, etc.)
I would think the Q50 will have to be very nicely equipped (meaning all the bells and whistles Infiniti can offer -- but not the hybrid version) and a few grand less to win, to conquer the pro German buyers.
I leased my current Acura TL SH-AWD Advance ONLY because it was much less than a 2012 A4 comparably equipped and a hell of a lot less than an S4 which the TL somewhat "imitiates."
I'll scope out a new A4, BMW and probably C class. Then I will do my best "objective" comparison with and without a consideration of price.
If the Q50 turns out to be BMW-like and is hundreds less per month in payments or thousands less in MSRP (and/or street price) and is either contented at or greater than the BMW, I'll very probably give the Q50 serious consideration.
If the Q50 is close to the "cost" of the German rivals -- with even somewhat close content, the German is with very high certainty going to be the chosen one.
I could be wrong -- but, not uncertain, of course -- and perhaps the new ex-Audi alum, Infiniti CEO will want to pump up the Q50's MSRP to achieve parity with the German "B" segment from the get-go.
My logic, hopefully not specious, is that the Infiniti Q50 no matter how much it is called the Japanese BMW will not be able to command BMW prices until such time -- if ever -- that people start calling the BMW, "the German Infiniti."
#15581 of 16985 Re: 320i [flightnurse]
Jan 29, 2013 (3:34 pm)
I'm still struggling to get over those new prices. I mentioned that already, but 320i sedan, if comparably equipped, would be priced HIGHER than my E91 328 wagon, with couple of (small) things even missing. Basically, 60 hp or so less, less metal, cheaper interior, pay the same. I dread the day pricing of new 328i wagon will be released (I assume it will be 328, not 320). I suspect it will start in low 40s shooting to something like 55 grand after putting same equipment, as my current one.
#15582 of 16985 Re: 320i [flightnurse]
Jan 29, 2013 (4:25 pm)
According to other sources they will expand the offering to include some Mb parts- as noted here...http://www.worldcarfans.com/113012953195/infiniti-q50-to-get-turbo-4-cyli- nder-and-a-diesel
So does that make them half German.
This was mentioned in some of my past posts ( you can search) that they have a platform agreement to share.
"Many people stated" ok that's a switch from the last post- but if you did a search it's a select few -
"Interesting to see what top q50 will go for" I could bet its going to be less then current 335, and prob closer if to "top" BMW 328 will go for and offer more( in tech for sure). Just like the g35 I own- did and does vs the comp at that time.. For the people who think the Infiniti needs a great car please look at us sales numbers vs Lexus is and acura to over the last 6 years- they have a great car - lets hope it's even better.
Blinders off - let's wait for the reviews and have a ride.
#15583 of 16985 Re: 320i [markcincinnati]
Jan 30, 2013 (5:42 am)
mark....I think a point can be made that at least the 328i and the 335i motors are WAY underated as far as power is concerned.
As you made mention of, getting a G (or now Q50) or an Acura TL to butt heads at the $50K mark puts them among the best of the segment (namely, the BMW, MB and the Audi). They don't want that fight if I had to guess.
Speculation, but sounds like the Q50 will be larger, with the same power trains. So, performance with today's G would be similar.
I'll reserve judgement on looks until it shows up in the flesh. But, if it comes in anywhere north of $45K, it's going to cannabalize the M, which is close to that number discounted.
Following the train of thought that the Q50 will be a slightly smaller M (will it become the M50 with the same 3.7L?), and given how slow the M is selling, anyone care to make a deduction on the new Q's sales numbers?
BTW, the local Infiniti dealer is advertising cars (relatively) cheap right now. $7K off a G37x. $5,500 off a G25. $6K off an M. A little ngetiation and probably beat those prices by a few hundred more.
Jan 30, 2013 (7:00 am)
Dino it is all relative, when I bought my 330i and the price I paid compared to what a new 335i is. But as we all know prices goes up and not down. So the new 3 series wagon is bigger then your's and the biggest complaint with the E90 was rear passenger room, and the 2013 wagon will have more room. I'm hoping that the wagon will come in RWD and AWD, I haven't gotten any conformation on it, which is odd, as I'm sure the final product has been approved.
#15585 of 16985 Re: 320i [graphicguy]
Jan 30, 2013 (7:10 am)
Graphic here in Phoenix the infiniti dealers have been taking $4500 off most G37s, maybe this is how they are selling so much, lets just discount them to a point that it makes sense to lease one over a BMW or Audi.
#15586 of 16985 Re: 320i [flightnurse]
Jan 30, 2013 (7:56 am)
So yes, it is relative. You expect prices to go up. But one expects also quality to at least remain, if not improve. I do not see this in new 3-series.
Well, replacing 330 with 335 few years back at similar price was a great deal, as 335 is much stronger than 330 and gas mileage was maintained if not improved. But the new 320 is going to be priced about same as previous 328 - and that is not a good deal. Especially because:
- the steering feedback on new 3-series is a step in WRONG direction
- quality of materials on new 3-series is clearly result of cost-cutting spree (chep "hard" switches, cheap "ratchet-like" feeling iDrive, cheap "hard" door latch from 80s).
- 50 horses was sent to pastures (180 vs 230), but you pay just about the same; you will gain miles per gallon, which some people will appreciate, but I find my E91 at 23-25 mpg on the daily commute satisfactory (not mindblowing, but decent).
I would consider 320 a good deal, but at price point about 5 grand below. And the got to fix the steering, the interior feel and the damn door latch.
#15588 of 16985 Re: 320i [flightnurse]
Jan 30, 2013 (10:08 am)
Wow imagine if you just signed a deal to buy a 57k automatic 335x - I'm sure that cats accountant would be pissed.
Dollars make sense - remember this is Elpps -
#15589 of 16985 New Q50 thoughts
Jan 30, 2013 (2:38 pm)
Having owned infiniti vehicles in the past, I always like to see and test drive the new vehicles when they come out. I recently looked at the JX this past December. For the money the inetrior and options were great. The drive was very sluggish without any guts. About 2 years ago looked at the M37 with interior and options great, but transmission did not shift well. Test drove the QX56 great pickup and great vehicle. Based on infiniti's trend the inside of the Q50 showed be very appealing. My concern is how it will drive as I am concerned about the transmission, only a test drive will answer that question. I find one cannot compare Japanese vehicle to German vehicle. They are very different and both have its positives and negatives.