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Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

16087 messages,  Last post on May 09, 2013 at 9:32 AM

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What is this discussion about? BMW 3 Series, Infiniti G37, Acura TL, Lexus IS 350, Mercedes-Benz C-Class, Cadillac CTS, Volvo S60, Audi A4, Acura TSX, Car Comparisons, Sedan

Messages Page 1488 of 1609

#14868 of 16087 Re: Saw the newest ELLPS... [habitat1] by flightnurse

Sep 13, 2012 (6:16 am)

Replying to: habitat1 (Sep 13, 2012 4:12 am)
Habitat- the Escalate is just a suburban with bling, nothing extra was done to it and of course weren't built very well, can't use that as a comparison to a German built car.
 
The reason why we got the Genesis at the price is the 2013 are rolling in, end of year, all manufactures are doing this, even BMW (with the 5 series). Currently here in Phoenix, BMW is offering $4500 off options (not too sure which option package they are referring to) plus $3K.

#14869 of 16087 Re: Saw the newest ELLPS... [robr2] by nyccarguy

Sep 13, 2012 (6:38 am)

Replying to: robr2 (Sep 13, 2012 5:44 am)
And I agree with you that a mid to high $50 something thousand dollar 3 series is absurd as well. Much of the 3's "advantages" may be gone as well due to electric power steering & suspension softening.
 
While it is true that 328xis are EVERYWHERE, especially silver ones like mine, the E90 is still an absolute blast to drive. I welcome the competition as well. The ATS looks nice, the next IS should be more competitive, the next G will probably make all of us BMW nuts think twice before a return trip to our local dealer.
 
When my lease is up in 2 years, I don't think I'll be shopping in this ELLPS category anyway.

#14870 of 16087 Re: Saw the newest ELLPS... [flightnurse] by robr2

Sep 13, 2012 (8:41 am)

Replying to: flightnurse (Sep 13, 2012 6:08 am)
Rob, the magazine's always say something like that when they aren't doing a comparison, on their own each might be a great car, but once you get the competition together the faults of each car are easy to see. I hope the ATS does well, competition only makes for a fun time and better products.
 
You're right - until the 2 are compared side by side, it's all speculation. But if the worshipers of the temple of BMW say it has a chance...
 
I too look forward to some competition for the 3 series. It's a great car but IMHO getting a little soft.

#14871 of 16087 Re: Saw the newest ELLPS... [robr2] by habitat1

Sep 13, 2012 (2:43 pm)

Replying to: robr2 (Sep 13, 2012 8:41 am)
I too look forward to some competition for the 3 series. It's a great car but IMHO getting a little soft.
 
Or....is it just that the 3 series has gotten too big? The current 3 series nearly as big (and heavy) as the 5 series from a few generations ago. And the current 5 is nearly as big as the 7 series was a few generations ago. Want small and nimble, a little one series, that seems tiny by today's standards, is not much smaller than a 1990 vintage 3 series.
 
The 3 series can still be made to be tight, as was proven to me as I rode in the backseat of a 4-door M3 being driven by a BMW instructor at their track last week. But look at the relatively low percentage of 335i's that are equipped with manual transmissions today, let alone sport packages and suspensions. I don't think BMW has gotten soft by their own preference - rather it's more the result of their objective to increase sales and, as such, having to cater to a lower common denominator when it comes to American buyers. Frankly, I wish they'd just tell the softee buyers to pound salt and buy a Lexus. But then again, I'm not a BMW shareholder.

#14872 of 16087 Re: Saw the newest ELLPS... [robr2] by flightnurse

Sep 13, 2012 (9:46 pm)

Replying to: robr2 (Sep 13, 2012 8:41 am)
I do hope the ATS is as good as what Cadillac has been saying in their commercials, however, history has proven that they have been short every time... I'm looking forward in driving a ATS and XTS, once national rental car gets them in, next week I'm back in Detroit so I'm hoping they have gotten the XTS.

#14873 of 16087 Re: Saw the newest ELLPS... [flightnurse] by robr2

Sep 14, 2012 (4:24 am)

Replying to: flightnurse (Sep 13, 2012 9:46 pm)
I do hope the ATS is as good as what Cadillac has been saying in their commercials, however, history has proven that they have been short every time...
 
I'm more interested in what the reviewers say as they get the most seat time in every car.
 
As for what Cadillac says in the ads....I've never seen any advertiser say "Hey our product is mediocre."

#14874 of 16087 Re: It finally happened [flightnurse] by billyperksii

Sep 14, 2012 (6:24 am)

Replying to: flightnurse (Sep 12, 2012 9:45 pm)
yeah right

#14875 of 16087 Re: It finally happened [billyperksii] by ivan_99

Sep 14, 2012 (7:44 am)

Replying to: billyperksii (Sep 14, 2012 6:24 am)
Unless you're the Mitsubishi Australian CEO
 
I don't know why people buy a Mitsubishi...What is the benefit?

#14876 of 16087 Re: It finally happened [billyperksii] by flightnurse

Sep 14, 2012 (8:27 am)

Replying to: billyperksii (Sep 14, 2012 6:24 am)
Bill did u own a Vigor when it was new?

#14877 of 16087 Re: Saw the newest ELLPS... [robr2] by flightnurse

Sep 14, 2012 (8:30 am)

Replying to: robr2 (Sep 14, 2012 4:24 am)
Rob, I'm talking about history, and even on Cadillac web page they say it is better then a 3 series... I just hope that history doesn't repeat itself.

Messages Page 1488 of 1609

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