Last post on Dec 06, 2013 at 7:58 AM
You are in the Sedans
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BMW 3 Series, Infiniti G37, Acura TL, Lexus IS 350, Mercedes-Benz C-Class, Cadillac CTS, Volvo S60, Audi A4, Acura TSX, Car Comparisons, Sedan
#12976 of 16984 Re: 528i 4 vs 6 cyl [sweendogy]
Jan 11, 2012 (12:10 pm)
I have lamented the lack of manual transmissions in these ELLPS and LPS cars for years -- my last manual was virtually the last manual that I could get in a car that I really wanted, and that was in a 2003 Audi allroad with the 2.7T engine.
Then I bought a 2005 Audi A6 with the 6-speed tiptronic, followed by a 2009 A4 2.0T Prestige with the sport package (also with the 6-speed tip). We have an '11 Infiniti with the 7-speed auto trans and I have test driven several 2012's that have 8-speeds (all German cars, of course). Frankly, my experience with a modern well-done 6,7, or 8 speed auto pretty much means I don't care, too much, if I never again have to row my own. The current crop of automatics really is, THAT GOOD!
The point is (finally), the reason for the paucity of manual transmissions offered to us 'mericans is -- us.
Even when manuals are offered, few dealers stock them and if you find one on a dealer's lot it will probably be a strippie because the dealer knows any manual transmission car will sit and sit and sit and sit on the lot or showroom floor (an unlikely place to find one). The dealer has to finance the stick shift car just like any other and then, ultimately, discount the car so much that repeating the process becomes about as far away from the dealer's mind as the nearest star (other than our sun).
Some of the cars can be ordered with stick shifts, but again, we 'mericans want to cruise in on Saturday, test drive the car, buy it if we like it and take it home the same day. Gotta have it! Gotta have it!
Moreover, getting a bunch of folks to pony up money or even letters of intent to a manufacturer to buy, en masse, stick shift cars hardly ever works. Quick story: my friend used to own an Audi/Porsche store in Cincinnati; he said AoA accepted a "petition" ("You cannot petition the lord with prayer") to import A6's with manual transmissions (this was a few years back) -- well AoA was still in recovery mode from the '80s unintended acceleration fiasco and son-of-a-gun if AoA didn't begin offering A6's with 6-speed sticks.
No one bought them (OK, VIRTUALLY no one bought them).
The dealers and AoA probably felt like those cartoon characters who when fooled turn into a giant Tootsie-pop.
The Acura TL AWD is offered with one of the sweetest and smoothest sticks in the biz -- MAYBE 3% of TL's are special ordered with a stick, maybe.
The Audi A4 (I better check) can still be had with a 6-speed stick; but the 8-speed tip is a sweetie -- I wouldn't bother with the 6-speed manual anymore, especially if I had to worry about resale.
Sure there are rabid, foaming at the mouth, stick-shift die hards who will pay a premium for a used car with a stick shift (and maybe even willing to do so for a new one), but there aren't many of them, so one's ability to sell the car when one wants to (or when the dealer wants to -- meaning in the same YEAR as they acquired it, for instance) is very uncertain, compared to the same car with the auto.
How about this: Let's see if we can get 500 people to send in deposits to -- which car maker and for which model? No way we could get 500 folks to agree to order the same car -- no way would that many people want a (pick one.)
I doubt we could even get 50 of us to pool our "votes" (read MONEY) to make it worth any manufacturer's while to let us buy one of their manual transmission versions of the XYZ model that they sell in other markets but not here.
Not gonna happen, again "You cannot petition the lord with prayer."
I say qwiturbitchin' at least here -- virtually all ELLPS and probably literally all LPS cars only are offered with automatics (and pretty soon, I'll wager, only autos will be offered due to any real marketplace interest in stick shifts.)
Folks that will actually buy stick shifts are about as hard to find (from the manufacturer's perspective) as living survivors of the Civil War.
There, I'm over them [stick shifts not Civil War survivors], too.
Drive it like you live.
"You cannot petition the lord with prayer" quote - The Doors from the album "The Soft Parade"
Jan 11, 2012 (12:16 pm)
Even though I accept today's automatics as excellent pieces of tech -- I must admit that I do, still, enjoy manual transmissions.
Having said that, I still believe manuals will soon pretty much disappear from the automotive landscape.
On the other hand, you gotta admire, somewhat, Buick for bringing out a couple of new cars these past 12-24 months that offer sticks (of course the dealers say they are novelties, not really someting that has much of a market.)
More's the pity.
#12978 of 16984 Re: manual trans. Re: 528i 4 vs 6 cyl [rayainsw]
Jan 11, 2012 (12:29 pm)
Thx you- meant to say base engine with a manual- atleast no the one I was looking at with xdrive . Thanks
Drive like you live
#12979 of 16984 Re: manual trans. Re: 528i 4 vs 6 cyl [sweendogy]
Jan 11, 2012 (1:08 pm)
The good news here is that the new F30 3-Series has more interior space than my 2002 530i; given that the 530i was almost literally the perfect car size wise for my needs, wants and desires, I can opt for the new 328i 6-Speed and have my cake and eat it too.
#12980 of 16984 Re: manual trans. Re: 528i 4 vs 6 cyl [shipo]
Jan 11, 2012 (1:39 pm)
I like cake.
Drive like you live.
#12981 of 16984 Re: 528i 4 vs 6 cyl [markcincinnati]
Jan 11, 2012 (1:55 pm)
I understand what you mean. First automatic I ever liked was a loaner 328i. Shifts were immediate, car never got confused or out of breath due to wrong gear ratios. Even a typical road disconnect due to torque converter (kinematic transmission) was not as present. I guess I may take my next car with auto, if manual is positively not available.
However, I just got a manual 328i in this Fall. And boy, isn't that machine sweet or what. I actually specifically got that 328 because it was THE ONLY ELLPS available as a manual wagon. Combined European Delivery and Performance Center Delivery (yes you can do both) is a three-month voyage full of joy and anticipation. While anticipation is a little frantic in last couple of weeks, the rest was simply fantastic. Mark, I see you're buying cars often, you should try it one day.
#12982 of 16984 Re: manual trans. Re: 528i 4 vs 6 cyl [shipo]
Jan 11, 2012 (6:23 pm)
"The good news here is that the new F30 3-Series has more interior space than my 2002 530i."
External dimensions are getting there too...
#12983 of 16984 Re: manual trans. Re: 528i 4 vs 6 cyl [fedlawman]
Jan 11, 2012 (6:28 pm)
Yup, but it is still smaller, lighter, more powerful, less expensive, better gas mileage, probably handles better, and has lots more goodies.
#12984 of 16984 Re: manual trans. Re: 528i 4 vs 6 cyl [shipo]
Jan 11, 2012 (7:06 pm)
There has probably never been a time in history when you got more car for the money than right now.
#12985 of 16984 Re: manual trans. Re: 528i 4 vs 6 cyl [fedlawman]
Jan 12, 2012 (6:01 am)
Interesting statement, what about 2008 when the eurusd was 1.60 vs 1.28 today