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Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

11073 messages,  Last post on Jul 16, 2009 at 1:47 PM

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What is this discussion about? BMW 3 Series, Infiniti G35, Acura TL, Lexus IS 350, Mercedes-Benz C-Class, Cadillac CTS, Lexus IS 250, Audi A4, Acura TSX, Car Comparisons, Sedan

#10827 of 11073 Re: Don't buy foreign cars! [adamr001] by plekto Mar 18, 2008 (2:31 pm)
Replying to: adamr001 (Mar 18, 2008 12:45 pm) Uh, fastest Buick ever? Don't make me laugh. Ever heard of a Grand National? How about GNX? Oops, I laughed.   And the LaCrosse Super, just like the the GNX, is a muscle car. Great in a straight line, but that's it.   A Sports Sedan/Coupe is: RWD or AWD. Manual available. As close to 3000lbs as possible. An emphasis on handling over straight line performance and HP.   Buick is: FWD. Automatic only. Nearly 4000lbs. Insanely powerful and overbuilt.   It's a muscle car. Is it any surprise considering what company made it? GM groks muscle cars, after all.   Compare it to a Impreza, RX-8, or GLI. (yes, these aren't luxury, though they are the essence of sporty). Dropping in leather and a bigger engine - that's Mercedes trick. And it's a complete dead-end as they've found with their E Class(which is a Taxi in Europe. Nobody in Germany buys one for personal use) Replies to this message: adamr001 (Mar 18, 2008 3:15 pm)
#10828 of 11073 Re: Don't buy foreign cars! [plekto] by adamr001 Mar 18, 2008 (3:15 pm)
Replying to: plekto (Mar 18, 2008 2:31 pm) I was merely refuting the fastest Buick line. It's definitely not a sports car and is soundly in the muscle car range as you rightly pointed out.
#10829 of 11073 Re: Don't buy foreign cars! [circlew] by jpstax1 Mar 18, 2008 (11:23 pm)
Replying to: circlew (Mar 18, 2008 6:44 am) He drove it into the wall? That reviewer must be an incompetent moron. BTW, for every negative review, there's a positive one, such as this one:   http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/hot_lists/high_performance/features_classic_- cars/the_quickest_sedans_of_2008_30_000_to_40_000_feature+page-4.html Replies to this message: mz6greyghost (Mar 19, 2008 3:28 am) shipo (Mar 19, 2008 3:51 am) sjaieve (Mar 19, 2008 6:56 am) circlew (Mar 19, 2008 7:30 am) ivan_99 (Mar 19, 2008 11:13 am) tayl0rd (Mar 19, 2008 11:20 am) and 1 more...
#10830 of 11073 Re: Don't buy foreign cars! [jpstax1] by mz6greyghost Mar 19, 2008 (3:28 am)
Replying to: jpstax1 (Mar 18, 2008 11:23 pm) Gimme a break!   It’s no GNX, and 20 years later, it is almost a second slower to 60 mph.   ...if not for the omnipresent torque steer, it might drive better than many Lexuses,   The question is... which ones? I'll guess they did NOT mean the IS.   The LaCrosse Super wasn’t designed to be a sports sedan, with all the comparisons that invites, and is instead billed as a “luxury touring sedan.”   Hence the reason why it doesn't belong in this category.   The 300 horsepower and the 323 pound-feet of torque will whisk upsold octogenarians to 60 mph in 5.7 seconds, if the torque steer at launch doesn’t snap their calcium-depleted wrists.   High praise indeed...
#10831 of 11073 Re: Don't buy foreign cars! [jpstax1] by shipo Mar 19, 2008 (3:51 am)
Replying to: jpstax1 (Mar 18, 2008 11:23 pm) Ahhh, I see you're a spin doctor. Nothing in that review even remotely suggested that the LaCrosse should be considered a "Sports Sedan". A "quick" sedan, yes, but fast in a straight line does not a Sport Sedan make, like it or not.   Regarding that review, hmmm, 8th out of 10 in a contest that stressed acceleration over handling, not exactly a stellar showing. Had handling been more on equal footing, the LaCrosse, what with its nasty nose heavy bias and FWD would have done even worse.   Regarding that crack you made yesterday about me researching what I post before I post, well, I think the content of the last many posts (forgetting yours of course) plus the two cited reviews (including the one you referenced) pretty much says it all. Simply put, the LaCrosse, regardless of how much motor is stuffed under the hood, does not belong in a discussion of "Sports Sedans".   Best Regards, Shipo
#10832 of 11073 Re: Don't buy foreign cars! [jpstax1] by sjaieve Mar 19, 2008 (6:56 am)
Replying to: jpstax1 (Mar 18, 2008 11:23 pm) The LaCrosse Super wasn’t designed to be a sports sedan, with all the comparisons that invites, and is instead billed as a “luxury touring sedan.” It does, after all, share its chassis and engine with Chevrolet’s Monte Carlo SS and Impala SS, as well as the Pontiac Grand Prix GXP, and front-wheel drive does none of these cars any favors.   This came from the article you referenced above, therefore its not a sports sedan Replies to this message: circlew (Mar 19, 2008 7:30 am) ivan_99 (Mar 19, 2008 11:13 am) tayl0rd (Mar 19, 2008 11:20 am) circlew (Mar 20, 2008 2:53 am)
#10833 of 11073 Re: Don't buy foreign cars! [sjaieve] by circlew Mar 19, 2008 (7:30 am)
Replying to: sjaieve (Mar 19, 2008 6:56 am) The only sports sedan GM makes is the 2008 CTS and the CTS -V. I do not consider '07 CTS and back a true sports sedan.   The usual. Oh well. We will continue to wait...   Regards, OW Replies to this message: ivan_99 (Mar 19, 2008 11:13 am) tayl0rd (Mar 19, 2008 11:20 am) circlew (Mar 20, 2008 2:53 am)
#10834 of 11073 Agree by r34 Mar 19, 2008 (11:02 am)
A sedan with big engine is not necessary a sport sedan. Better handing and feedback from the road are more important than 0-60 time; otherwise, a 200+ minivan may be considered as "sport minvan" (don't get me start talking about those stupid minivan drivers who think they have a sport car).   If that guy keeps talking about FWD sedan, maybe a Saab 9-3 is the best Sport Sedan for GM because it is more a sport sedan than the Buick (I know, it may not have the best handling but it is not bad at all).However, it is a Swedish (import again). I remembered the Viggen has 155mph top speed too and most 9-3 can go beyond 145mph (4 cyls turbo vs. Buick's...).   A lot of cars have very high top speed but not all of them can be driven safety and stable at that speed.
#10835 of 11073 Re: Don't buy foreign cars! [circlew] by ivan_99 Mar 19, 2008 (11:13 am)
Replying to: circlew (Mar 19, 2008 7:30 am) Actually drove an 08 CTS DI (close to fully loaded (45k) with sport suspension...not the extreme one...one down (all season tires)) as well as a 6spd (non DI) which was pretty basic.   The DI was very nice with a panoramic roof; gorgeous on the inside and out. With the TC turned off I was able to get the back end out a couple feet. It was fast but not a "wow". The shifts were very smooth (that was a wow)...but when doing my power slides (never buy a demo car ) the auto-manumatic took over a second to shift...so i bumped it off the rev-limiter before it decided to shift.   The 6spd was nice as well...didn't have the rush in the higher rpms; but the throws and clutch take up was ok (not disappointing) . Although there was a high amount of vibration coming through the manual (similar to a G37 I drove a couple weeks ago).   The CTS does need the upgraded interior...the base really does look like a "base" and shouldn't be sold with the name plate (assuming they want to keep it prestigious)
#10836 of 11073 Re: Don't buy foreign cars! [circlew] by tayl0rd Mar 19, 2008 (11:20 am)
Replying to: circlew (Mar 19, 2008 7:30 am) ... I do not consider '07 CTS and back a true sports sedan.   Why not? And what about the STS and STS-V? Replies to this message: circlew (Mar 20, 2008 2:53 am)

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