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Questions About Auto Insurance & Accidents

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#21 of 4422 Ok folks by kcram HOST Feb 18, 2002 (2:52 pm)
If you cannot discuss issues without taking personal shots at each other, I will start shutting down discussions.   This is the LAST warning from Car Man or myself.   kcram Host Smart Shopper and FWI Message Boards
#22 of 4422 by miagarfunckle Feb 18, 2002 (5:47 pm)
Hey lets all act like adults in this forum. I don't want it to be shut down.
#23 of 4422 mia by eimeria Feb 18, 2002 (11:17 pm)
Thank you for taking the time to dispense some of your knowledge so that we all can become a little bit more learned about the mysterious workings of our insurance carriers after we've gotten into an accident.   I saw your post in another topic about determining when a car is totalled. Let me pose my situation to you so that I can get your take. I am the owner of a 1997 Honda Accord SE with approximately 70K miles on it. I was involved in an accident in which the other driver was at fault. My car sustained front end damage that cost $9800 to repair. Much to my surprise, replacing the airbags cost a significant amount. I have a $500 deductible which was paid by the other gentleman's insurance (which was also my insurance carrier). Insurance also paid almost $400 for rental car costs. The accord was in decent shape'; it had been involved in one previous accident when I was rear-ended at a red light. In that instance the rear bumper and a sway bar (??) were replaced. I understand now that KBB isn't the guideline used for determining the value of a car, but I find it hard to believe that it makes sense for my insurance carrier to pay $10k to fix a 5 year old Accord. I saw similar sounding vehicles being sold in my local paper for not much more than the cost to repair my car.   Can you shed some light on the rationale to repair such a vehicle? Even after reading some of the posts here and in the other thread, I still come to the conclusion it would make sense to total it. Could you provide any insights in to what drove the decision to repair instead of total in this instance.   Thank you again for your contributions to this board!
#24 of 4422 by miagarfunckle Feb 22, 2002 (6:58 am)
Eimeria:        It depends on the particular situation. Every insurance company is different in how they determine when a car will total. For example some use a percent of value so when the estimate gets to that point the car is considered a total. Some companies use 80% and some companies just use the value of the car minus its salvage value for a total loss. In your case I doubt they used a percentage formula as a 1997 honda accord with 10,000 worth of damage I would think would be a total especially with a front end hit because safety then becomes in issue. Can it be safely repaired? Sometimes an insurance company will take a vehicle to a shop thinking that it can be repaired and discover a lot of additional damage and figure out the car should be totaled but decide to repair it as they have already invested a lot into the car in order to discover that damage such as towing, storage, teardown costs and re-stock fees for ordered parts. A lot of times an insurance company will decide based on that. I am not sure about your situation but without more information then if they paid your ded. and $400 in rental then I myself would like to ask them why it is repairable. If I were you I would bring up the safety issue to repair the vehicle.
#25 of 4422 miagarfunkle by eimeria Feb 22, 2002 (1:30 pm)
Thank you for taking the time to answer my questions. I did bring up the safety issue with them when I was told they were going to repair the car. They told me part of their decision was that the cost to replace the dual side front airbags was close to $2k. Otherwise the repair costs were not all that significant to them and there would be no difference in safety after the repairs were completed. To me, $8k still seems like a pretty significant repair cost, but I then again I'm not privy to the info that they used to decide to repair and not total the car. My foremost concern with the vehicle is safety. The car is now fixed and seems to run ok, but ... I still don't feel comfortable with my wife driving it to and from work everyday. I'm sure at this point I have no recourse, but I am left with a car with diminished value and uncertain safety.
#26 of 4422 ak4X4: Associate of Arts Degrees do not count and by kinley Feb 24, 2002 (11:38 am)
neither do the numbers. Attitude more than amptitude determines your altitude in business.
#27 of 4422 eimeria by im_brentwood Feb 28, 2002 (3:16 am)
Uh Oh...   Didnt we just give ya a value over in RWTIVs? =O   Seriously, you need to pursue a diminished value claim.   I'm honestly shocked that your car was NOT totalled.... $9800 on a 97 Accord SE with 70K?   wow.   Still, that's easily (Undamaged.. no paintwork..etc..) a $8,500 wholesale car at the moment.. So $10,500 or so is what I'd say you should shoot for ona private party sale...If it hadnt been hit.   It just doesnt make sense to me that this car was fixed.   Bill
#28 of 4422 Brentwood by eimeria Feb 28, 2002 (3:09 pm)
I posted in the RWTIV about my Pathfinder. I was in the market for an Acura TL-S when I was involved in an accident in my wife's Accord. I was just driving along in the left hand lane when some jackss driving oin the other direction decided to make a left hand turn into one of the stores on my side of the road. He didn't even look and pulled out about 15 ft in front of me. Driving at about 35 mph, I never even had a chance to hit the brakes. Thank god for airbags and seatbelts. I was able to walk away with a concussion and some whiplash, but more importantly I walked away.   I was shocked that the car wasn't totalled. I'm sure you're probably not going to be an expert on this topic too, but I figure it doesn't hurt to ask. Your advice on these boards so far hasn't steered me wrong (got fair value on my pathfinder based upon your estimate, and used your fax attack method to get what I consider to be a great price on my new TLS). What does a diminished value claim entail? Who would I even make the claim to (thoughts of me standing on a tall rock, thrusting a sword into the air and declaring "I now claim that my car has diminished value!" are rushing through my head =). )   When I was arguing with them to total the car, they claimed that the car was worth about $12500. I disputed that figure, but I wasn't sure if I was shooting myself in the foot with that arguement. Me: "the car isn't worth that much. It's only worth $8k." Them: "OK. here's your check for $8k".   If it were you, how would you procede?
#29 of 4422 eim by im_brentwood Feb 28, 2002 (3:55 pm)
Oy! I got nervous there..thought I might said "Yeah its worth 8K-8,500.. expect that" and you're running around getting hit at $5,500-6K thinking Im a twit! Whew   You need to have the car appriased, in writing, with a statement like:   Wholesale Value: $8,500, Retail Market Value:$10,900 Deduct $2,000 for previous accident repairs.   Then claim against the ins. co.   Bill
#30 of 4422 Bill by eimeria Mar 06, 2002 (8:13 am)
I looked into filing a claim for diminished value by calling my agent to find out if there were any addendums that excluded those types of claims. They were shocked to hear that the car was repaired given the amount of damage it had received. The agent decided to look into it with the adjuster who handled my claim. The adjuster claimed that I gave permission for the repairs to be done. To me, that's an interesting defense. At no point was I given a choice in determining whether to repair it or not. Instead I was told that the car was repairable and given a ballpark estimate. At that point in time I argued vehemently that the car should be totalled, but the only satisfaction that discussion brought was that I was able to yell at some claims guy in the central office for 30 minutes. If you only tell me it is repairable, you aren't really giving me a choice. The agent has asked me to write a letter so that they can investigate the matter. I don't think that is going to do me any good in the end.   As far as a diminished value claim goes, my agent told me they are not covered under my insurance in PA. Said my only recourse would be to take the other driver to small claims court when I go to get rid of the car.   While the money that I will lose in value of the car is important to me, the safety of the driver (my wife) is more important. At this point, I don't see any great options that I have. I'm going to write the letter so that they can start an investigation, but as I said, I doubt anything would come of that. I've documented all conversations I've had regarding the car, but they have no incentive to do anything at this point. do you have any advice? this is all uncharted territory for me.

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