Last post on Mar 31, 2013 at 4:37 PM
You are in the Vans & Minivans
What is this discussion about?
Toyota Sienna, Dodge Caravan, Chevrolet Venture, Mazda MPV, Kia Sedona, Honda Odyssey, Chevrolet Uplander, Nissan Quest, Hyundai Entourage, Van
#863 of 3798 Re: GM minivans? [jipster]
Jun 23, 2005 (6:29 pm)
No one will admit they were duped into buying an "SUV" that is just a slightly warmed over inferior minivan that GM had a hard time peddling as a minivan.
I own a GM product (Chevy Blazer) that is inferior to its Ford counterpart (Explorer). GM pickups are not as good as Ford and neither GM nor Ford make a minivan that is competitive with the Grand Caravan/Town & Country, Odyssey, Sienna, or your MPV.
Based on preliminary data on the 2006 KIA Sedona, the BIG 3 of minivans (GC/T&C, Ody, Sienna) will have some serious competition. Same with the 2007 Mazda MPV.
Jun 24, 2005 (2:44 am)
Flexibility: DaimlerChrysler vans
Luxury: Toyota Sienna
Sporty Driving Dynamics: Honda Odyssey
Price: Kia Sedona
There. I prefer the Odyssey over the Sienna though, but they're close enough nowadays that you can't go wrong either way. Back in 2002, it was a different story.
#865 of 3798 Re: Well [jchan2]
Jun 24, 2005 (3:27 am)
Agree almost 100 % with jchan2. Only change would be to have Price be either KIA Sedona or Caravan.
DaimlerChrysler rebates, incentives, discounts place some Caravan/Grand Caravan about as cheap as KIA Sedona even though KIA has large rebates, incentives, and discounts.
IF the 2006 KIA Sedona lives up to current available information, the KIA may become my # 1 Choice although I seriously doubt a Sedona will ever be as luxurious as a Sienna XLE or XLE Limited.
Chrysler has watered down the Town & Country Limited with cheap feeling leather and a cheap looking interior so a T&C Ltd is no longer a luxury vehicle.
A 2005 Chrysler T&C Touring is $760 MORE than the clone 2005 GC SXT and is not as attractive with the cheap looking grille that resembles earlier Voyagers which were entry level minivans.
#866 of 3798 Toyota Sienna problems
Jun 24, 2005 (3:46 am)
Toyota brochures list many options for each Sienna model. Problem is that most of the options are NOT available.
I checked Denver region, Northwest, and Kansas-Nebraska-Dakotas-Iowa-Missouri and was shocked to learn that the limited options of the Denver region are greater in number than the even fewer options of the other regions closest to southern Wyoming/northern Colorado.
Denver region has only LE Pkg # 2, # 6, and another more expensive option. For XLE there are XLE Pkg # 4, # 6, and # 7.
To get separately controlled temperature for a Sienna in the Denver region, I would have to purchase a Sienna XLE with at least XLE Pkg # 4 which puts the MSRP at $32,365 compared to an Ody EX MSRP $28,710, a GC SXT at MSRP $27,725, a Caravan SXT at MSRP $23,465 or a SWB T&C for $23,055. The DC minivans currently have a $2500 rebate so the Caravan SXT would be $ 20,995 and the SWB T&C $ 20,055.
In the Northwest region, a 2005 Sienna XLE must have at least XLE Pkg 6 at $4975 making an XLE $34,765.
The Odyssey has the most straight forward, least confusing vehicle availability of the BIG 3 of minivans.
However, to me the $8,000 lower priced Caravan SXT or SWB T&C (vs Ody EX) is a much better deal. My 2002 T&C LX and my son's 2002 GC Sport have been just as reliable as another son's 2001 Ody EX. The savings over a Sienna XLE is $12,000 to get the comfort feature that is most important to me and my wife.
Jun 24, 2005 (4:51 am)
hansienna, have you spent time in the 2002-2005 Sedona EX? It really is a fairly high-end interior. Nice materials, excellent fit and finish. The interior quality is the high point of our Sedona. It has lots of *vehicle* features you don't get in some other minivans, or at least didn't get back in 2002 when we bought ours. E.g. power lumbar on driver's seat, power front passenger seat, moonroof, a great-sounding factory audio system, etc.
The 2006 Sedona should be a noticeable step up in pretty much all areas, including the interior.
I cannot compare to Sienna since I've spent no time in one.
It does lack some of the *minivan* features such as power sliding doors, but I haven't really missed not having power sliding doors. My wife does, though.
#868 of 3798 Here's my "unbiased" opinion
Jun 24, 2005 (12:13 pm)
We are savvy and cheap, so there's no way we'd spend more than $23-24K for a van or anything else for that matter (other than a house). For you all that spend $30K plus on your van, where IN THE WORLD do you find money to pay that monthly payment after the mortgage, grocery, 401K (you do that right?) and tithe (to keep your pastor alive )? I was only half kidding. I'm dying to know 'cause I consider ourselves quite well off and it's very hard for us to shell out $800 for the car payment.
1. The Honda is nice but costs at least $25-26K. Forget it and end of discussion.
2. The Sienna is ok. NOTHING about it stands out and strikes you. Folding 3rd row seat--everyone has that; ditto for the power doors; zero flexibility with the 2nd row seats. And when I test drove it, I went "where's the luxury everyone is talking about"? The ONLY thing attractive to us is the 8 passenger seating.
3. DGC has all the right features that one needs for the right price...IF one can get over the depressing and ancient-looking dark grey and black interior. It has almost zero emotional attractiveness.
4. Ford--too expensive, and what do you get?
5. GM vans--too small, too expensive, too few features . And what's so good about looking like an SUV?
6. The winner is...the Quest--the van we bought . It's got great styling--all our friends "wow"ed when they first saw it. They "wow"ed again when I showed off the cool features--power door, hatch, parking sonar, 2nd row almost-fold-flat seats, fold flat 3rd row seat, and the tons of clever storage spaces, and its HUGE and comfy seats, and HUGE head room. Not to mention traction control and the side curtain airbags. For all these, we paid $21,750 before TTL. The base model without the power door, hatch, parking sonar and power rear windows could be had for $20,200. Talk about good values!
Now your turn...
#869 of 3798 Styling isn't in my value equation
Jun 24, 2005 (12:24 pm)
Sounds like a really good price on the Quest and a nice van, but if price and value were so important - why in the heck were you worried about STYLING?
You could have had a 2005 Kia Sedona for $16-20k. $20k will buy you a very well-equipped vehicle that lacks some gee-whiz minivan features that some folks can't do without, but other folks don't miss one bit. $16k will buy you a nice powertrain with a comfortable, medium-sized minivan. Not much competition down at these price points - DCX vans perhaps. Also maybe stripper Fords or GMs, but those are a cut below Sedona IMO.
#870 of 3798 tamu2002
Jun 24, 2005 (12:27 pm)
Okay, assuming you are referring to the 8 passenger seating at the same time you say the Sienna has zero flexibility with the 2nd row seats; let me point out a few things you may not realize:
With the Sienna 8 seater, the middle seat can be placed in line with the outboard seats, creating a comforable 3 person bench, or it can be positioned well forward placing an infant within easy reach of the front seat. Or the middle seat back can be folded forward creating a wide table/armrest for the other 2nd row occupants. Or it can be removed entirely leaving a very wide aisle to the 3rd row.
With that middle seat removed, the right hand seat can also be repositioned next to the left hand seat creating very easy assess down the side to the 3rd row. And finally, either one or both of the 2nd row seats can be removed further expanding the hauling capabilities of the van.
Now, the last part may not be as convenient as the stow-n-go feature of the DCX offerings, but I don't think it could be considered to have "zero flexibility".
Waitaminute........"tamu2002" wouldn't happen to be because you are a 2002 graduate of Texas A&M would it? That would explain a lot......
#871 of 3798 MPV...Zoom Zoom
Jun 24, 2005 (1:04 pm)
Agree with 1-5. Though for #6...you should have had Mazda MPV. Just substitute "HUGE"...for MORE THAN ADEQUATE. Can get a loaded LX with rebates etc for $18,000. Pound for pound...the minivan heaveyweight champ of the world.
I agree though with styling..if I didn't care how something I was driving looked, I would have bought the 2004 Ody.
Took 2 test drives in the Quest...interior materials and fit and finish seemed subpar.
#872 of 3798 Re: tamu2002 [rorr]
Jun 24, 2005 (1:14 pm)
You guessed it! I'm a proud Aggie And what would that explain ? Help me out here will ya? You would'nt happen to be a longhorn, would you judging by your location ?
Yes, I was aware of what the 8-passenger Sienna 2nd row can do. I shouldn't have said "zero flexibility". Like I said, we REALLY liked that. I was mainly refering to its inability to fold flat. Your point is well taken.