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Minivans - Domestic or Foreign

3643 messages,  Last post on May 20, 2009 at 6:32 AM

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What is this discussion about? Toyota Sienna, Dodge Caravan, Chevrolet Venture, Mazda MPV, Kia Sedona, Honda Odyssey, Chevrolet Uplander, Nissan Quest, Hyundai Entourage, Van

#3544 of 3643 No problem, kmauss... by heelntoe Aug 18, 2008 (11:08 am)
To summarize, based on my recent (our GC is one week old) buying experience, here is what I discovered. For the most part it agrees with what thegraduate says. Having owned three Dodge products, two Acuras, a Honda, a couple of BMWs, a Jaguar, a Mini, two Nissans and a Fiat, I consider myself to be brand-indifferent.   Dodge Grand Caravan - Same basic vehicle as the T&C. In more basic 3.3L and 3.8L trim, it's not really competitive with basic Honda or Toyota trim levels. They offer more refinement and, statistically speaking, more reliability and resale. In 4.0L trim the GC is competitive (at least on the refinement and power parts) and available for $1,000s less than the T&C. Availability of the 4.0L on lots was much better than the T&C as well.   Chrysler Town & Country - See above for the most part. Want more bling than the GC and don't mind paying for it? Go this route. Not that you want the tow package but there wasn't a T&C with tow package to be had within 75 miles when I was looking. Dealers seem to be loaded up on the "Signature" edition (special package) with the 3.8L and carry very little else.   Honda Odyssey - If you have reservations about domestic or can't find the 4.0L GC at a reasonable price, the Odyssey, in my opinion, is the best buy on the market right now. They're pretty easy to get at invoice minus $2500 in dealer cash even if you don't like/want to bargain. With Honda's relatively flat trim-level and optioning model, it's very easy to find the trim you want in the color your want, even in 08s at this point. Three local dealers had exactly what we wanted. Supposedly the best-driving but I think it felt larger and only marginally better than the GC.   Toyota Sienna - Like thegraduate mentioned, finding one like you want with CE, LE, XLE and Limited, 7- and 8- passenger seating, AWD and FWD is next to nearly impossible without some time investment or letting a dealer "locate" one, which usually results in paying a bit more somewhere. At least with Dodge and Chrysler, the window stickers are available online. Only $1800 in cash so the deals aren't as good as on the Honda. They're supposedly quieter and not as harsh but I didn't notice it that much. Both my Mini Cooper S and Dodge Ram have aftermarket exhausts and the Mini has an cowl-inducted intake and over-driven supercharger (lots and lots of intake roar) as well so... Every minivan is quieter than they are.   Chevrolet Uplander - GM seems to offer this just so they have a minivan to put in the Chevy showrooms. Not competitive by any means. You may be able to get a screaming deal on one, like the Quest as both have to be either EOL or near-EOL. The Saturn Relay (Uplander twin) has already been cancelled. The Uplander is missing many features considered to be essential in the market. It just misses the mark by nearly every measure. I think if you read much about this van, it's probably bad. The only good part may be the price.   Nissan Quest - I'm not sure this is even coming back for 09? The platform is due for replacement but I think Nissan may have written off this market. Nissan showed some concepts that could be a new Quest but very little has been heard about a potential replacement. They may have abandonded the market like Ford and GM, almost. It's a bit long in the tooth like the Uplander but my wife liked it and I said if we could steal one, it would be a consideration. Dealers have very, very few of them right now it seems. There were none at my two local dealers.   Hyundai Entourage - I wouldn't buy one but... They've come a long, long way in ten years and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend one to somebody wanting lots of content for minimum money with any brand handups whatsoever. I'm not brand specific but I've still got a hang-up, probably unjustified, about Hyundais. Worth a look especially if you're looking at the lower end of the segment.   Kia - I still wouldn't go there, I don't think. I didn't look at them at all.   Hope this helps. Sorry I'm so long-winded. Might as well do the brain-dump while this is all fresh on my mind, right?
#3545 of 3643 Re: Considering Van/minivan as third vehicle, advice sought [thegraduate] by kmauss Aug 18, 2008 (12:23 pm)
Replying to: thegraduate (Aug 18, 2008 10:56 am) So THAT's what that is! I have seen this exact little creature buzzing around my neighborhood but I haven't been able to catch what it was or who made it. I am going to have to check this one out too.
#3546 of 3643 by ateixeira Aug 27, 2008 (12:20 pm)
$17.1k for a new Quest is a great deal. Wow. Congrats. I think they started at $20-22k when I was shopping about a year ago, that's quite a drop. That low price might make you forget the 2nd row windows don't open.   Chevy's van is going of production. You may find some leftovers, but beware: resale will likely be dismal. They replaced the Uplander with the Traverse crossover. It does have good towing capability, but costs more and has less space than most vans. The Uplander lacked 2nd row windows that open, no magic 3rd row folding seats, no side curtain air bags. It would be a good van 12 years ago, but not today.   Mazda5 is nice and indeed fun to drive. They just gave it a better transmission that improved the EPA mileage a lot, but it's much smaller than most vans are. Same for the Rondo, which is well price but IMHO doesn't drive as well as the 5.   The Dodge Journey falls inbetween in terms of size, bigger than the 5/Rondo but still a lot smaller than most minivans. Haven't driven one.
#3547 of 3643 Re: Photos of T&C, Ody, and Sienna [thegraduate] by hansienna Sep 01, 2008 (9:31 am)
Replying to: thegraduate (Aug 16, 2008 1:16 pm) Look at the GLARE from the center stack of the Sienna from these nice photos which clearly demonstrate the Ody design superiority while the Sienna dash is the most poorly designed with curved shiny surfaces that reflect sunlight. However, the Sienna instrument cluster is a pre-2006 model without the Optitron gauges.   The Ody leather seats look more comfortable with better quality leather than either the T&C or Sienna. I also prefer the Ody lack of fake wood. Replies to this message: ateixeira (Sep 02, 2008 11:00 am) yatesjo (Sep 02, 2008 12:45 pm) ateixeira (Sep 02, 2008 12:56 pm) and 2 more...
#3548 of 3643 Re: Photos of T&C, Ody, and Sienna [hansienna] by ateixeira Sep 02, 2008 (11:00 am)
Replying to: hansienna (Sep 01, 2008 9:31 am) My 07 gauges are fine, no glare to complain about here.   I had my cousin's Ody for a couple of weeks, and I sweat my Sienna's seats are much more comfortable.   It's a 2002, I think, so one generation back, but I like my van a lot more. Replies to this message: yatesjo (Sep 02, 2008 12:45 pm) ateixeira (Sep 02, 2008 12:56 pm) hansienna (Sep 09, 2008 2:29 pm) and 1 more...
#3549 of 3643 Chip munks by ateixeira Sep 02, 2008 (11:03 am)
First problem with my 07 Sienna - chip munks ate up my wiring harness!   Sadly I believed the service rep right away because that happened to my 1998 Forester, and to a lesser extent to our 2002 Legacy as well.   $740 worth of damage. Wires were chewed up, and the knock sensors went haywire, probably from short circuits.   The tech got a photo he'll show me tomorrow.   Unreal. Chipmunks!
#3550 of 3643 Re: Photos of T&C, Ody, and Sienna [ateixeira] by yatesjo Sep 02, 2008 (12:45 pm)
Replying to: ateixeira (Sep 02, 2008 11:00 am) Ateixeira, I'm with you. I've not seen any problems with glare on the dash of our van, and we've driven it in bright, bright (AZ and CA) sun at every possible angle. The Sienna dash is also nicer for having a more organized and thought out layout compared to the Honda's scattered and seemingly random control placement.   In back-to-back comparisons versus the Odyssey when we were test driving vans we found the seats in both fairly comfortable, but the Sienna had the advantages of being quieter and of being able to comfortably fit 8 adults in 8 passenger trim compared to the mother-in-law seat in the Odyssey. A week after we got the van I took a group of 7 co-workers to lunch in the van and favorably impressed all with the comfort even in the third row. Replies to this message: ateixeira (Sep 02, 2008 12:56 pm) hansienna (Sep 09, 2008 2:29 pm) ateixeira (Sep 10, 2008 9:58 am)
#3551 of 3643 Re: Photos of T&C, Ody, and Sienna [yatesjo] by ateixeira Sep 02, 2008 (12:56 pm)
Replying to: yatesjo (Sep 02, 2008 12:45 pm) The real 8th seat is what sold me, too. It's a full 20" wide. Compare that to the Ody's bridge, and there's no comparison. Replies to this message: hansienna (Sep 09, 2008 2:29 pm) ateixeira (Sep 10, 2008 9:58 am)
#3552 of 3643 Re: Photos of T&C, Ody, and Sienna [ateixeira] by hansienna Sep 09, 2008 (2:29 pm)
Replying to: ateixeira (Sep 02, 2008 12:56 pm) BUT the 8 passenger Sienna 2nd row seats have NO armrests.   Apparently my back side is not too wide because I found the 8th seat (+1) in the Odyssey quite comfortable. I prefer ALL seats in the Odyssey to those in the Sienna. Replies to this message: ateixeira (Sep 10, 2008 9:58 am)
#3553 of 3643 Re: Photos of T&C, Ody, and Sienna [hansienna] by ateixeira Sep 10, 2008 (9:58 am)
Replying to: hansienna (Sep 09, 2008 2:29 pm) We fold down the center seat when it's not in use and the kids can rest their arms on there.

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