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Vans & Minivans Minivans - Domestic or Foreign
3643 messages, Last post on May 20, 2009 at 6:32 AM
You are in the Vans & Minivans Forum. Your Host is Karens
| A horrific crash is likley to kill anyone in any vehicle. Picture a head-on with a truck! Point is, you can get a Ford Windstar with great crash protection but horrible reliablity, or a Honda Oddessy with both reliability and crash protection. We have the Venture, which to be sure is not good in the frontal offset crash tests. It has been reliable and comforable, and I think it's safe. | |
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"I would think the driver profile for these drivers would be as similar as it can get" Similar, yes. Identical, not by a long shot. Again, compare the twin vehicles I mentioned. T&C and GC, Quest vs. Villager, etc. Identical vehicles, identical crashworthiness, yet different injury/death statistics. I'd be happy to hear any other explanations for these variances. Precision is one, but that would then mean all the results are poor. For death rates, notice that they publish a margin of error. With margins like that, the statistics don't appear to have great precision anyway, even if you ignore the fact that driver profile is a big part of the variances among identical vehicles. "How exactly do you buy a vehicle if you eliminate those Significantly worse performers" I said worse than average. Personally, I'm very skeptical of any vehicle design that earns 3-stars or less in any NHTSA test, or a "Marginal" or "Poor" in the IIHS test. These tests are well established, and the parameters are well known to manufacturers. If they can't design a vehicle to do well in these tests, why should I be confident they have made a good safety cage or restraint system that will be effective in other types of crashes that may vary from the tests? As for injury and death rates, even excluding driver profile, most minivans are better than the overall average. Overall, Winstar, Sienna and Odyssey pass all the crash tests and rollover ratings with flying colors, and have lower than average injury and death rates. Odyssey and Windstar both appear to be average or lower than average in injury and death rates, even just within the minivan category. Everyone will use their own criteria, obviously, I simply suggest thay buyers consider all the available data, and not just one piece that makes one particular vehicle look good or bad. That seems to be pretty much your conclusion, also. Mass and length are also important safety factors in crashes between different vehicles. Most minivans have a big advantage there, too. |
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you can get a Ford Windstar with great crash protection but horrible reliablity How do you define horrible? If you are using those misleading red and black bars in Consumer Reports, keep in mind that their average problem rate for 2001 is 0.2 problems per vehicle over the last 12 months. At that rate, even a Windstar (about 50% below average predicted reliability) would take years to have even ONE more serious problem than a Sienna (about 30% above average). |
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| http://edmunds.yellowbrix.com/pages/edmunds/Story.nsp?story_id=26916814&ID=edmunds&scategory=Auto& | |
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For my sister, a new 2001 Odyssey EX was the best. For my wife and I, a new 1999 Grand Caravan in March 1999. Inky now drives a 2002 Odyssey after having 2 Siennas and a 1999 Odyssey. Swampcollie is now driving a 1999 Grand Caravan Sport after complete satisfaction with 2 other DC minivans. My friend Kurt got a 2000 Grand Caravan LE after satisfaction with 2 previous DC. Some people do not like Astro and Safari. We had excellent experience with our 91 Astro CL and actually prefer the panel doors to the liftgates that are on most minivans. Jim W. hates his Windstar (he got used) but there are many friends who love their Windstars. Bill T. traded a Toyota 4Runner on a Windstar a few years ago and now has another Windstar. My good friend Terry A. loves his 98 Sienna LE. |
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We are in the market for a new minivan for the first time in nearly 10 years. We now own a 93 mercury villager and have loved it for the ease of re-configuation of the seating, car-like driveability and minimal repair (several major this past year, but none prior). There are lots of great alternatives out there and I'm getting overwhelmed with options and compromises. The one feature I had hoped to get is a numeric keypad entry (frequently lock keys in car). I have only found this option on the Windstar. Do any other models still have this feature. It was available on Villager in '93 but no one seems to offer it now. Also like the Odyssey for the flip and fold seat but it is missing several small features like conversation mirror (for spying on kids in the back). Sienna is ok but after having the "instant cargo room" capability on the Villager, we don't relly want to have to remove seats for cargo room. So, I'm back to the Villager or the Quest. Am I crazy to be considering a discontinued model? Do these vehicles still have the Maxima engine in them (I thought I read that they now have a "bullet-proof" truck engine)? Any thoughts out there? |
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I don't think you'd be crazy to buy an orphan, assuming you get a great deal on a Quest or Villager. If you traded cars every 3 or 4 years, I'd say no way - the depreciation hit would be too great. If we were looking to replace our '99 Quest, we'd look hard at the Sedona and MPV initially since our preference is for the smaller vans. Keypads are "passé" now that everyone has gone with fobs. I like the fobs (no scratches around the door lock), but I do keep a spare key hidden under the bumper. Fobs are pricy to replace. I doubt that you'll find any keypads available, but other little touches, like the conversation mirror, are probably available as an aftermarket item to upgrade an Odyssey (or whatever) to your liking. And the Odyssey and MPV have "magic" seats that are convenient for instant cargo room without removing seats. Steve Host SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards |
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Steve's right - not too many keypad equipped vehicles out there any more. Key fobs seemed to have done away with the key pads. Have you looked at the GM's? We have an Olds Silo Premiere and are really happy with it. Rear set folds down easily for expanded storage. It has onstar so if you lock your keys in the car, you can call onstar from any phone, give your account and code number and they will unlock the car remotely. Pretty nifty! Other nice features include a car-like ride, rear parking aid, dual power sliding doors, LOTS of cargo space (we got the extended version), leather, heated seats, tow package, rear VCP/Video, triple zone climate control, etc. etc. and a 6/60 bumper to bumper warranty since Olds is on the way out. Since you seem to keep cars like my family (forever), don't worry about going with a Quest if that's what you want. Keep in mind, however, that the Quest does not have a fold flat or hidaway rear seat. Instead, you take out the second row captain's chairs and slide the third row seat on a track all the way to the front. But for that feature, the Quest would have been a very strong contender for us. No keypad either. As for the conversation mirror, we picked up one aftermarket at our local Auto Parts store. It attaches to the windshield with a suction cup and sits right above the rear view mirror. There are also ones that actually attach to the rear view mirror or clip to the visor. I wouldn't base a minivan purchase decision on that feature alone. Good luck! |
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Had a keyfob on my Villager that broke within the first year, but i'm sure they are much sturdier now. I wouldn't base my decision on the reaview conversation mirror but I do get tempted by the keypad on thw Windstar. My significant other says "no way" to the WS as their rear seat does nothing. We love the sliding track rear seat on the Villager and Quest and may go with it again. Have been looking at the MPV online and reading the town hall notice. Might have to go visit that one in person. Thanks for your quick response. |
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That's a great plug for OnStar too, yzf. I have a friend who's always locking his keys in his truck - he could sure use it. Steve Host SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards |
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