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Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Toyota Camry Prices Paid and Buying Experience
7929 messages, Last post on Dec 06, 2009 at 4:25 PM
You are in the Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum. Your Hosts are car_man & kyfdx
| Please help me. I am going through one of the most unethical behaviors I have ever seen, and after all the price negotiation, the 2009 Camry LE I4 auto I liked would cost $18,600 before tax versus only $17,500 in many other So. Cal. dealers. The reason why it is more because the salesman made all kinds of stories telling me the VIN # starts with J (Japan), and they would need to charge more for it, even though the MSRP is the same in all other Camry LEs. Just because it's Japan doesn't mean a dealer should have the right to charge way above average LE price, when they have several J models in-stock right now. Is it right for a dealer to charge $1,000 more for a basic Camry LE? Or should I threaten the dealer to bring the price down more? This is at Longo Toyota at El Monte, CA. Yeah, yeah, I can't believe they are doing this to a loyal customer. This will be the last time I will do business with them. cry: | |
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Replying to: waltchan (Oct 21, 2008 7:49 am) |
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Replying to: kiawah (Oct 19, 2008 4:59 pm)
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Replying to: manny_37 (Oct 21, 2008 8:59 am) |
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Replying to: waltchan (Oct 21, 2008 7:49 am) can i get 2009 Camry LE in Chicago area for 17500. Thanks
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Replying to: manny_37 (Oct 21, 2008 8:59 am) as lucky_777 has already stated, always start from the invoice base price including the invoice price of all the additional options for the actual car you are considering. You can get all that info right here on edmund's. Then subtract all of the dealer incentives including 2-3% holdback off the TOTAL invoice price. Holdback is a built in profit margin provided to the dealer from the factory. They get this additional money from the factory after the car is sold. From this subtotal above, add 3% for dealer profit (they do have to make some money after all). Then subtract the rebate if that applies. Work from this total as a starting point. You are best to set up a spreadsheet to track all of this. Now from here, a dealer may have additional hidden incentives for doing minimal monthly sales volumes or whatever. Who knows exactly what these are, but it is more likely the larger high volume dealers or those with several dealerships under a comon umbrella will have these incentives. These are not on individual car sales, but volume. If you suspect they do, then figure another 2% for that maybe. These days of course, a dealer may not be getting much from these incentives. As well, a dealer gets a certain percentage of the price of the car to finance the actual purchase of the car by the dealership from the factory and hold it at the dealership for 4-6 weeks. Ie. the cost of the loan to hold that car for the 4-6 weeks is paid by the factory from what I understand. If the dealer sells the car quickly right off the delivery truck, they can pocket that amount. Finally, in particular areas, dealers may have additional costs for advertising and marketing. Those are all bogus in my opinion and the cost of doing business and in no way should be an explicit itemized cost. They are negotiable. If every dealer in the area charges for it, then they don't have any incentive to negotiate. Your only choice usually is to go out of area to a different dealer. Any other costs are completely bogus and should not even be factored into your negotiating price. Don't believe any of the BS sales people claim about true costs. They are lying. They want to deceive you and instill doubt. It's called intimidation. Information is power. It makes the saleman's job all that harder. That's why they hate it. Always negotiate your price based on the above. Costs such as tax, DMV licensing fees, recycling fees, document fees are all fixed costs and can vary locally. These should be added in later for your final price. As well, always negotiate the value of a trade-in separately. Now having said all that, if you can get a deal based on this info, you should be not be paying more than 3% above invoice not including any rebates. The rebates should take you down to invoice or below. Some people can do even better than this in more competitive areas of the US such as southern CA. dmcd
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Replying to: rvs2000 (Oct 21, 2008 9:35 am) |
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Replying to: dmcdonnell (Oct 21, 2008 10:08 am) Also, I know Toyota is doing a $1000 financial rebate or 0% for 36 mos. What's the smartest option? Take the $1000 and finance from someone else? Or take the 0% for 36 mos? Lastly, any tips on how to get to this desired price? I know to wait till the end of the month, but that's about it. Thanks!
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Replying to: weniki (Oct 21, 2008 11:34 am) I don't know of any source that will provide you with the hidden dealer incentive info except for rumors and tidbits here and there. Supposedly there are some newsletters you can buy that list some of this stuff but I don't know how thorough they really are. EG. this one: link title. Not too impressed with that one. The november/08 newletter didn't even have the new camry rebates. If you are in a known competitive market such as Southern CA, then these incentives likely exist due to the higher volume of sales. As for the financing, it depends upon whether you have disposable income to make that choice of course. A dozen or more posts back, I posted an analysis of the rebate vs 0% financing. For me, I chose the 0% financing. Why? Because I know I will be keeping the car for at least 5 years, and it's likely I can make at least 5% or much more on the cash I did not use to buy that camry, especially since the stock market is so down at the moment. The financing offer will likely be worth more as long as you are sure you will own the car for the 36 month term of the loan. You can get the best price by several methods. I think the easiest one is to use something like carsdirect.com, costco, or some other wholesale broker that sends bids to the dealers. The price you usually end up paying with them is around invoice or a little above. For me, time is money, so I think these services are worth it even if you pay a few hundred dollars above the nes tdeal out there. If you don't like their price, you don't have to accept it, but it will give you a very good idea of the highest price you should pay. If you want to negotiate with the dealers themselves, bypass the typical sales floor or 'internet sales' person (some dealerships have a dozen 'internet sales' people that are a regular sales person with a different title) and deal directly with the fleet sales manager by calling them to get their name and introduce yourself, explaining you will be buying a vehicle and they will be competing with other dealers in a bidding process. Then send him/her a fax directly, describing the vehicle you want and ask them to bid on it. It's important you address the fax to them directly, as you don't want any joe blow sales guy to pick up your fax. this is the so called 'fax blitz' method. Try to fax as many dealers within your immediate area, then if necessary, expand the group to dealers within 200 miles. Don't even bother going into a dealership unless you enjoy the bantering process and like spending 2hrs at each dealership you consider. Some people are good at this and can get a decent deal, but they will spend hours at the dealership. Try to get a firm price using the fax method before you set foot in a dealership. Dealers are very hungry at the moment. I still get calls from some of them asking for my business even though I have already bought the car. Waiting for the end of their sales month (whatever date that is) is always good of course. If you want to reason with a sales person at the dealership, make sure you have your spreadsheet which lists all the invoice pricing for all the options since they may not have your exact car. Just keep in mind that even though you may not want one of the options in the car they are offering, you still need to account for the invoice cost of it and add in some sort of profit for the dealer from your calculated base cost. You can explain to the sales person that you are an informed buyer and you are willing to pay invoice cost plus x% profit to the dealer or whatever. If they start questioning your numbers and their validity, stand firm and say they have a certain time to make the deal before you walk away. And be wlling to walk away. cheers, dmcd
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Replying to: dmcdonnell (Oct 21, 2008 12:31 pm) I will take your advice and try all the above tactics starting with carsdirect/costco first. THANK YOU AGAIN! |
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