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Forums
Maintenance & Repair Fuel and Oil Additives
1246 messages, Last post on Sep 28, 2009 at 7:37 AM
You are in the Maintenance & Repair Forum. Your Host is mr_shiftright
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (Mar 21, 2009 5:40 pm) Nik |
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Replying to: shipo (Mar 21, 2009 5:47 pm) Nik
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Replying to: shipo (Mar 21, 2009 5:47 pm) As for "reversing wear", that is scientifically impossible in an engine IMO. You can gum it up for a while and boost compression a bit but other than that, there's nothing in a can that replaces metal that I've aware of. Really all this is, is rather vague anecdotal evidence, which may have been sincerely passed onto you, but which is characteristically very unreliable and which proves....well....nothing at all. It's just a "story". Unless this product can be tested with a blind group (non-additive engines, run under same conditions) and verified by an agency outside of the people who make the product, then it is not above suspicion. I'm not surprised you're finding a challenge recruiting believers. There's no good evidence to support the claims being presented to us. But if you have independent scientifically rigorous testing results, fire away, I'll read 'em over. |
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Replying to: niknmax (Mar 21, 2009 5:57 pm) So, as Mr. Shiftright kind of suggested, please provide us with some scientific back-up to your anecdotal claims. Best regards, Shipo |
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Replying to: shipo (Mar 21, 2009 6:28 pm) One reason the synthetics didn't produce more dramatic results was that the conditions were not the type where synthetic excels, that is extreme of climate and extremes of engine "work". Taxicabs pretty much putt around all day and bang into things at 40 mph or under. This isn't the Indy 500 or pipeline work in Alaska or the Mexican Carrera. Results? 1. Changing oil at 3,000 miles isn't necessary 2. Slick 50, STP Engine Treatment produced no discernible benefits. http://www.moneybluebook.com/articles/consumerreports.oilchange.php
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (Mar 21, 2009 6:47 pm) Additves are good or not? When should one change their oil, according to the dealer package specifications or the manual? Or even at 5,000 miles of city driving or 6 months, whichever occurs first? I recall that my dealer and different car dealers over the years does add a can of fuel additive to the tank at every one or two year service interval. This is standard and if you go "by the book", the manual typically says not to add any fuel or oil additives. When asked why they do it, the consensus always has been that the quality of fuel varies among gas stations, although the "baseline" is the same. I've tried the cheap Techron fuel additive and I haven't noticed an improvement but people swear on the effacy of the concentrated more expensive version. Racing enthusiasts and their mechanics only fill up with top tier fuel. Like someone mentioned a few posts back, there may be a benefit from adding fuel additives (finding which ones that actually work and won't gunk things up is the hard part) may help if you're using them on an ongoing basis. In any case, I think objective third party studies need to be done on fuel additives for vehicles. BTW, I didnt click on the link by Mr. Shiftright, in the event some of my questions were answered. 
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Replying to: ex_tdier (Mar 21, 2009 7:21 pm) Most of the posts seem to gather around three points: 1. Total skepticism -- or, "under normal conditions with good fuel---NEVER NEEDED." 2. The "placebo effect" --- or the anecdotal and subjective statement --"it feels better after I added it" 3. confusion over causation vs. correlation ---- I added it and THEN my car ran better (question being---did it just clear itself up, or ???) |
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Replying to: shipo (Mar 21, 2009 6:28 pm) Measurable result - compression loss caused by cylinder wear. Might anyone be interested in taking an engine they have with compression loss and trying the process? It would be insured against damage. I am new to these types of forums, so if what I just offered is inappropriate. please tell me. I am just trying to be creative because I know what I am seeing is real. Nik
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Replying to: niknmax (Mar 22, 2009 12:19 pm) How would this mysterious ceramic know how much to build? And why would it not adhere to EVERY metal surface, instead of just pistons and bearings? Why wouldn't it build up my camshaft lobes or my timing chain? I'm sure there are no complaints of harm, because the additive is probably an inert substance. If this company can do billions in business, why can't they afford a clinical trial? I'm sorry but so little of what you are presenting here makes any sense. At least not so far. But you know, keep trying if you like. As soon as I hear something plausible I will raise my hand in your favor!  Slick 50 -- lost lawsuit to FTC (false advertising) Duralube--lost lawsuit to FTC MotorUp -- lost lawsuit to FTC Fuelmax - lost lawsuit to FTC Zmax -- settled out of court Prolube-- busted by CR as useless, but not prohibited by FTC as yet MotorBond-- new kid on the block, jury's out. Haven't really dug into this one. |
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Replying to: niknmax (Mar 22, 2009 12:19 pm) =============================================================================== I've discovered this new [process | substance | preparation | additive] that can [eliminate engine wear | dramatically improve fuel economy | repair/reverse engine damage or engine wear]. I know that this sounds like many other products before it, but [I've seen it work with my own eyes | it has been proven to work by the {pick your favorite research facility, real or imagined} | our internal labs have run exhaustive tests and proven its efficacy]. As proof of how good our product is, we have sales of [some number] billions of dollars and we haven't even a single dissatisfied customer. If you are not completely satisfied with this product, please return it to the place of purchase for a complete refund. =============================================================================== Please understand, I'm not saying that your product doesn't do what you say it does. What I am saying is that you haven't said anything that would even remotely pique my interest, and that everything that you have said makes you sound like a snake-oil salesman (not saying that you are, just that you sound like one). As I said before, when you come back with some compelling and verifiable science (i.e. something way-WAY-WAY more compelling than "I've seen it work."), I'm sure that some of us, me included, will be more than happy to review your data. Best regards, Shipo
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Maintenance & Repair Fuel and Oil Additives
