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Automotive News & Views Gas Saving Gizmos & Gadgets
332 messages, Last post on Jul 20, 2009 at 12:19 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
Hi. Just using gas gas is not an option even 1+1=10 , let it sit  or if can offer not use gas opposite  it is what it is now . sevenup |
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Did you take vitron up on his offer to come out to your locality and install one of his gizmo's on your Grand Caravan? Maybe, you are in the process of liquidating all your assets to fully invest in this guys product? If this is what is going on, don't let your Edmunds pals out on getting a piece of the pie. Let us know. Don't be greedy dawg! 
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Replying to: jipster (Jun 29, 2008 2:25 pm) Trust me, if I get the opportunity to play guinea pig, I'll let y'all know, for better or for worse.  Best Regards, Shipo |
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to debunk the "run your car on water" myth Posted Jul 8th 2008 at 12:54PM by Jeremy Korzeniewski A quick Google search is all that is required to find hundreds of stories of people who claim to have increased their fuel mileage by installing a hydrogen generator which extracts hydrogen and oxygen from water and funnels the gas into the engine. Some of the claims are pretty wild, and the Japanese company Genepax has again lit a fire under the topic of running a car on water. While the Genepax car uses a conventional fuel cell, most of the "kits" available on the Internet introduce a bit of gas into the engine which is then combusted along with the liquid gasoline. It is, of course, natural to feel a desire to buy into the hype promised by these systems. The truth, though, is that large fuel economy gains are highly unlikely. Popular Mechanics has decided to build themselves one of these systems for testing. The mag intends to install the finished product in an automobile and report back. We're keenly interested in their findings, though we're pretty sure we already know what will happen. Stay tuned. |
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This site was linked from the News section at fueleconomy.gov, the US EPA website: "These widely-advertised devices, known variously as a "hydrogen generator" or "hydrogen booster," claim to be able to use electricity from your car battery to split water into its components of oxygen and hydrogen. This supposedly forms what is called "Browns Gas." Scientists say the idea is preposterous, with one saying the energy created would "not amount to a hill of beans." 'Run Your Car On Water' Scheme Could Leave Consumers All Wet (Consumer Affairs.com) |
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Replying to: texases (Jun 04, 2008 5:44 pm) Can anybody tell me is the HHO Gas is real working or is another scam?
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Replying to: johnandrews52 (Jul 19, 2008 1:54 am) |
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Replying to: johnandrews52 (Jul 19, 2008 1:54 am)  Okay, so here are a few more thoughts on saving gas that might actually matter to a few of you: I was an industrial engineer for a decade, and in college a friend built a bubbler, loosely based on these claims. He did have a slight increase in mileage (half a mile per gallon), but that could have easily been his city/highway driving mix or just the extra work he did on the car while prepping his little experiment (it was a hooptie old Nissan sedan, and he never did ANY maintenance, that I'm aware of, so he did hours of work and got a questionable improvement). If you're driving a big truck or SUV, the best thing you can do is check your air in your tires. I was getting about 13 mpg and hadn't checked the tires in a while. I was only a few pounds low in 2 tires, and I jumped to a hair over 16 mpg, for the last two tanks of gas. That's almost a 25% improvement for a few minutes of time (a couple of quarters, if your gas station has a coin-op air compressor). Few people are having any luck with the programmers (other than people with big diesel engines), because they are tuned for performance with premium gas, and you only see improvements if you drive like a grandma. It still doesn't make sense to get rid of an older car, just to buy a new one with better mileage. People are freaking out about this, instead of thinking it through. Here's how the numbers REALLY work (ignore the TV and internet ads): If you are getting 15 mpg now in your monster truck (which is paid off), and you drive 15,000 miles per year, you're buying 1,000 gallons of gas, call it $5,000 at $5 per gallon (sorry, folks, but it's still going up, and will probably be at $5/gallon, if not higher, by X-mas). Okay, say you buy a Prius, and you average 49 mpg (my father-in-law uses his daily for his 52 mile per direction commute, and that's what he averages). So, to drive that same 15,000 miles, you will need about 306 gallons of gas, and you will spend about $1530. So, you'll save $3430, right? No, you won't. You don't own a Prius, so you have to go buy one! To figure your cost correctly, you need to add the cost of gas plus the cost of the car payment (the monster truck is paid off, right?). So, let's assume that you find a Prius in stock (good luck!), and you opt for a few goodies bringing the total to $27,589 (because you don't really have a choice, you're going to buy what you can get, and if that one has extras you don't want, tough, wait another three to six months... Oh, and that's the Touring version with everything but the navigation system, which is what my wife and I were going to buy 3 years ago, except a local corporate buyer ordered 300 of them, and we were told we'd have to wait 9 months before we could get ours...). Okay, let's say you find a buyer for your monster truck and get something out of it (we'll be kind and say $5,000, because, let's face it, not too many people are buying SUVs, right now), so that puts you financing around $23,000, monthly payments of something like $450 for 60 months. So, the final cost is REALLY: monster truck $415 a month in gas, plus any maintenance and repair work. New Prius, $450 a month in car payments plus $127.50 a month in gas. Now, this is all based on an optimum situation. What happens if you owe more on your SUV than you can get for it (being 'upside down' on your note)? You got problems. What if you are still making payments, but you can get out of your old car for less than you owe? Well, you can make a bigger down payment, and the monthly payment for the Prius is lower. What if you buy a cheaper used car that gets decent mileage? Well, your payments would go way down, but your gas costs would be somewhat higher. For example, we also have an '05 Scion XB, which you could pick up for around $12,500, in our area. With nothing down (assuming you were upside down on your loan) and 36 month financing (more common for used cars), your payments would be about $375. Mileage is right at 30 mpg, on average, so monthly gas would be about $210 a month. Not bad. The monster truck is still better. But, if you CAN get $5,000 for the monster truck, then you only finance about half of the car cost, and you could get payments of about $230 and $210 a month for gas. This is still a bit more than gas for the monster truck, but it's a reliable Toyota vehicle, and this one is actually about as comfortable inside as our older Tahoe (it's narrower, but the leg room in front and back seats is excellent--and I'm 6'5"). So, even buying a used car with very good gas mileage is still slightly more expensive than sticking with your monster truck, and, depending on how much importance you place on your vehicle, may be a bit of a blow to your ego (even though the XB is a cool and funky ride). And if you have green activists giving you grief, then ask them how many tons of carbon emissions and energy expenditure went into building them a new car, while you are just recycling in a big, vehicular kind of way. See the great article in the June Wired or on their website Keep Your SUV-June Wired.
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Replying to: vpitman (Jul 24, 2008 7:19 am) Check out our Gas-Guzzler Trade-In Calculator In the news at Yahoo: 4 Gas-Saving Deals That Rarely Pay Off
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Replying to: steve_ (Jul 24, 2008 11:05 am) I guess its not really quantifiable most times, so that's the problem. But, for instance, I tried it by plugging in a coworkers situation. She has a '94 Volvo 960 with 120k miles that is in constant need of repairs (she neglects it until it demands fixing). One of the cars she is looking at is a Honda Fit. Well, the calculator spits back that it would take her around 13 years to break even. But it obviously doesn't point out that the Volvo won't go for 13 years without SERIOUS repair costs. But, maybe the calculator is only intended for those trading in something newer with low miles. (?)
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