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Buick Rendezvous, SUV
#1141 of 2541 Engine stalling--bad gas or something more serious?
Jul 27, 2005 (9:57 pm)
I just spent the last few hours reading this forum and must say "Wow!" I wish that I had known all of this before I bought this car. Anyway, I bought a used 2003 Buick Rendezvous CXL with AWD back in March. It had 40,800 miles on it then and now has 45,000. Everything has been great until last week. Shortly after filling the car up with gas, it started to have ignition problems and the "service engine soon" light came on. When I would crank it, there would be a bit more cranking than usual before the car started. Also, it would sometimes stall requiring additional cranking. It idles a bit rough as well. During a trip this weekend, the car actually cut off while decelerating at a highway off-ramp a few times. My assumption has been that I got hold of a bad tank of gas and need to simply drive it all out. However, I fear, after reading these forums, that more is a foot.
I drove all but a gallon of the "bad gas" out yesterday and put in 17 gallons of premium 93 octane. At least momentarily, the car started better. However, I have noticed the same symptoms persist today (some stalling at ignition, rough idle, stalling during deceleration). In reading this thread, I have noticed that others have had a similar problem. However, before assuming the worst and running to the dealer, I am wondering a few things:
1. The manual says that low-quality gas can have this effect on a car and that I would need to use at least a tank of high quality gas before the "service engine light" went off. Does anyone have any experiences with "bad gas" in these vehicles?
2. Could this be the ignition relay switch, which was the subject of a recall for Rendezvous's and Aztecs produced between Oct. 2003 and March 2004? Here's information that I got from the NHTSA website:
ON NOVEMBER 10, 2004, THE OFFICE OF DEFECTS INVESTIGATION (ODI) OPENED A PRELIMINARY EVALUATION TO INVESTIGATE THE FAILURE, MALFUNCTION, OR OTHER UNSATISFACTORY PERFORMANCE OF THE ENGINE CONTROL SYSTEM WHICH MAY RESULT IN ENGINE STALLING IN CERTAIN MODEL YEAR (MY) 2004 BUICK RENDEZVOUS (GMT257) AND PONTIAC AZTEK (GMT257) VEHICLES ALLEGEDLY CAUSED BY IGNITION RELAY FAILURE. ODI IS AWARE OF 68 NON-DUPLICATIVE COMPLAINTS AND 1092 WARRANTY CLAIMS RELATED TO THE SUBJECT ISSUE. THERE ARE NO KNOWN CRASHES RELATED TO IGNITION RELAY FAILURE ON THE SUBJECT VEHICLES. BY LETTER DATED APRIL 19, 2005, GENERAL MOTORS CORP. (GM) HAS NOTIFIED ODI THAT IT WILL CONDUCT A SAFETY RECALL (NTHSA RECALL NO. 05V-157) TO REPLACE DEFECTIVE IGNITION RELAY MODULES IN APPROXIMATELY 34,996 SUBJECT VEHICLES BUILT BETWEEN OCTOBER 13, 2003 AND MARCH 8, 2004. THIS PERIOD OF VEHICLE PRODUCTION IS ASSOCIATED WITH ESCALATED WARRANTY CLAIMS RATES AND COMPLAINTS THAT ALLEGE ENGINE STALL DUE TO IGNITION RELAY FAILURE. GM HAS IDENTIFIED PARTS SUPPLIERS WHO USED MATERIALS CONTAINING SILICONE IN THE MANUFACTURE OF SPECIFIC COMPONENTS FOR THE IGNITION RELAY MODULE. SILICONE CONTAMINATION CAN RESULT IN SILICA DEPOSITS FORMING ON THE CONTACTS AS THE RELAY SWITCHES AND THE HEAT GENERATED BY THE RESULTANT ARC CONVERTS THE SILICONE TO SILICA. SILICA BUILD-UP ON THE CONTACTS IS PROGRESSIVE AND MAY PRODUCE A VOLTAGE DROP ACROSS THE RELAY SUFFICIENT TO CAUSE AN INTERMITTENT NO-START OR ENGINE STALL CONDITION. WARRANTY ANALYSIS INDICATES THE INCIDENCE OF NO/HARD START VERSUS ENGINE STALL TO BE EQUAL. ANALYSIS OF TOWING CLAIMS AND DETAILED SERVICE RECORDS INDICATES THAT VEHICLES MAY EXPERIENCE RESTART DIFFICULTIES AFTER A STALLING INCIDENT APPROXIMATELY 20-30 PERCENT OF THE TIME. THE USE OF SILICONE MATERIALS IN THE MANUFACTURE OF THE SUBJECT IGNITION RELAY HAS BEEN DISCONTINUED. THE ACTION TAKEN BY GM IS SUFFICIENT TO RESOLVE THE ISSUES RAISED BY THIS INVESTIGATION. ACCORDINGLY, THIS INVESTIGATION IS CLOSED.
Again, I am going to try not to assume the worst, but any responses are welcome.
#1142 of 2541 Re: Hard Riding Tires [nidge]
Jul 28, 2005 (5:19 pm)
Please see mine..I think numbers 3943 and then one close to that about the car riding hard. My car is 04 AWD Rendez...I bought it with 1500 on it, and have only 4K on it now...It's going to dealers on Monday, and being serviced not by an adviser, but the SERVICE MANAGER. I promised the folks here, I'd let them know all what happens between harsh ride with affinities, squealing brakes, a/c switch and whatever else. Good luck. Keep pursuing the dealer...
#1143 of 2541 Re: No restart after re-fueling [afmark]
Jul 30, 2005 (7:28 pm)
Sorry, afmark! I gave the wrong initials. Check out Message #971 but here's the site: http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/complain/complaintsearch.cfm
Apparently, if enough people complain at this site, the issue becomes a recall. Everyone here should go to this site and report their RDV problems.
Since I had the wheel bearings fixed, everything else has been fine, especially since GM finally paid me $494.80 back for the second repair. I put new brake pads on today (on the rear) and at 75,000 miles, the front was great and the back pads were showing wear but I believe this is normal wear. After reading all of these other problems, I'm feeling pretty lucky!
#1144 of 2541 Re: Squealing brakes, noisey ride, hard tires and a/c blower [ragtop262]
Aug 01, 2005 (3:39 pm)
Hi Ragtop and JK27..
It's Me again..Gail! I promised a follow up to you so here it is. Finally, the day came when I took the car to the dealer and it was literally worked on by the Service Manager watching it for the day. Here goes-Car was there all day until 6pm.
Brake Pads- "not brake pads"- but "rust/dirt" build up on the wheels. Does this make sense to you guys? They cleaned all the pads, pulled off all the tires to check brakes, all was fine. (Car is 04 AWD w/ 4K on it). This I am told, was the heavy thumping noise in the front. I was then told they heavily lubricated everything they could under the body that could be lubricated, and told me every time I do the oil change (did that today too), that it is recommended for these vehicles. The A/C fan shutting itself off when it's 100 degrees outside, is a Resister and the replaced that. They also let some air out of the tire to soften the horrendous ride of "hard knocks" :O) I"ve been complaining to you about, (Those affinity H/T tires), and then did something to front and rear suspension so they'd be in "sync" per se. I really can't explain this, other than to tell you to put your hands thumb to thumb, and let that be the frame (this is how it was explained to me).Now with both thumbs nail to nail, move the hands up and down ...IE: one up and one down like on a stair climber. Supposedly, the suspension on one side hits the road and bumps before the other side, because the highways are "warped" if you ...to correct that, they balanced something out (not an alignment..something that could be adjusted along the frame under the car) and oiled up a "shaft"...I hope I'm not totally confusing you all. The shaft wasn't going in and out as smoothly as it should and now those hands of yours should flap up together and down together in the above example. Thought everything was ok..was ready to go at 6pm, Serv. Manager asked me to go for a ride with him and so we did. Immediately, thump, thump, thump! He turned the car around and drove it right into shop, saying this is unacceptable. He put the car back on the lifts, and thought maybe spare tire was loose, but it wasn't. He now things it could be a rear "bushing"? He's told me to drive it w/o any fear of safety issues, and when it rains (If I can take the noise that long), if it doesn't do it when it rains, then it's the bushing because it'll be lubricated from rain water. If it does do it, then it could be the control arm or something. I'm sorry......I don't know much about this stuff, but hope you can get the gist of it and tell me if it sounds right or not. This dealer seems sincere, does care, and did soften up the ride home..I don't know about dropping the air pressure, as to whether it'll ruin tires faster or affect the handling. He's told me no to both. Any thoughts on the rear thumping?? TO me, it sounds like it's in front, but immediately, he told me it's def. in the rear. Sorry this is long, but wanted to get back to you all, and maybe there's something to help others here. Thanks much! Gail
#1145 of 2541 Re: No restart after re-fueling [chrisrappl]
Aug 02, 2005 (7:49 am)
Thanks for the information. You might want to note this defect on the NHTS web site http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ I got the address from another member and I posted my complaint. Apparently this seems to be the only avenue to document these type problems.
#1146 of 2541 Re: No restart after re-fueling [mnyhats1]
Aug 02, 2005 (7:59 am)
Thanks for the help mnyhats. I went to the site and logged my complaints. What bothers me is Buick has to know how many problems they have had with starting, wheel bearings and such, but of course they refuse to admit they have that kind of data available.
#1147 of 2541 Re: This isn't a problem per se [fedlawman]
Aug 02, 2005 (10:45 am)
Yes. We had to have the electric motor for the passenger side mirror replaced a few months ago. After backing up, it would get stuck in a downward position and
acted like it was having spasms trying move back into upright position.
#1148 of 2541 Re: No restart after re-fueling [chrisrappl]
Aug 02, 2005 (10:15 pm)
This summer, my 2002 Rendezvous began having re-cranking problems after driving around in the heat and humidity. Since it re-cranks some of the time but not others, no one seems to know what's wrong with it. Also, the problem doesn't seem related to re-fueling but does appear to be related to the heat index. Up until today I've been able to let the engine rest 15-20 minutes, and then it would restart. Unfortunately, this afternoon that didn't work, and I'll have to have it towed to the dealer tomorrow. Is your Rendezvous still restarting and is the new E7450 sensor module & N2320 Ignition Switch (Passlock System?) continuing to solve the problem? Thanks
#1149 of 2541 Re: No restart after re-fueling [bobandgracie]
Aug 03, 2005 (9:39 am)
I have had the same problem. Check out message 1137. Also, you may want to post this information on the office of defects investigation web ste at http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/home.cfm . Also check their file on the 2002. There was a service bulletin issued on April of 2004 concerning the powertrain control module being unable to properly communicate on board diagnostic ... which is one of the error codes I have on my 2002. Also, the printout I got when I took the car into the dealer indicated a "possible pass lock" problem.
In addition, I have been talking to Buick and have gotten them to reimburse me $160 toward the repair bill estimated at $320.
One last thing - yesterday I ran some errands and let the car run. I then turned off the engine and did some shopping. When I re-started the car, the engine caught but the idle went from around 800 rpm down to about 400 rpm and then after a few seconds back to 800 rpm. The reason I mention this is that when I have had starting problems, the engine caught and I immediately shifted into reverse at which time the engine died and would not re-start for about 25 minutes. Also, that 25 minutes is "dead time" in that any attempt to start during that time will make the problem continue. Don't know if there is a connection here, but it might be worth trying.
#1150 of 2541 Re: AC Condenser [regalluvr2]
Aug 04, 2005 (10:58 am)
Hi, same problem here with the condenser. What do I say to the customer service in order for them to fix my condenser ?