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Honda Accord, Coupe, Sedan
#22701 of 32215 Re: Price of Accords went UP Dec 11th?? [kim100]
Jan 21, 2009 (8:28 am)
"Second, my greatest concern at this moment is that the dealership is telling me that all of a sudden (in the midst of negotiations) the 2009 Accords increased in price as of December 11, 2008 and that there was a $250 ad fee."
Honda did indeed raise the prices on all Accords across the board (it would have been nice if someone told me!!!). For example, Edmunds still shows the MSRP for the 2009 Accord LX at $22225.00 but if you look at Honda's web site, you'll find the MSRP is now $22375.00 (after adding the ever-present destination charge). This got me up and out of my chair to check my own invoice vs. MSRP on a recent shipment from the factory. I found a 2009 LX which has been on the lot for eight days. I pulled the invoice and found the invoice price increased $200.00 while the MSRP went up $150.00
In the last 30 days I was aware that Honda raised invoice and MSRP on the Fit and the Civic but I was unaware the Accords were involved in the increase. So, I have checked MSRP from Honda vs. what I have and there was a $150.00 across the board increase in MSRP and $200.00 across the board increase in invoice.
Further research on my part shows EVERY new Honda had a price increase CRV's went up $150.00 ($200.00 invoice), Elements up $100.00 ETC....
My advice to you is make sure the car you're looking has the MSRP of $22225.00 and not the new $22375.00. That invoice will be $200.00 less then the current one. The advertising fee; you have to pay it. As stated in previous post it is a LEGIT charge.
Now I get to go correct everyones price book. Great another all day task!
#22702 of 32215 Re: Price of Accords went UP Dec 11th?? [kim100]
Jan 21, 2009 (11:37 am)
A couple things:
1) In today's business climate, I simply cannot believe that a car manufacturer would raise the prices of its cars to dealers, without a corresponding increase in rebates/givebacks/whatever. So technically Honda may have raised the "price" of the Accord, but the dealer isn't paying a dime more, net-net. In fact, interest rates have come down, and this is the worst car-buying market in years, and manufacturers have huge inventories, so if anything, the dealers are paying less. Just another dealer game to make you feel good about buying. Sorry to be so cynical.
2) Don't get caught up in the rebate/holdback/bonus/cashback game. That's the game the dealers want you to play, and they have the home field advantage. It's just a psychological tactic they're trained to play to make you feel comfortable signing on the dotted line(s). If they know you're playing that game right along with you, they can wear you down, beat you down, then they have the upper hand. And don't play the "monthly payment" game either.
Remember that not only is the "dealer invoice" not a true indication of the net cost to the dealer of a car, but that we as consumers (no matter how good we are at Googling) can never know how much a dealer actually makes on a car.
So the only thing that should matter to us as consumers is the bottom line. I don't care how the dealer gets to the number, I just want the best number, and I need a high degree of confidence that no other fees will be thrown in there at the last minute to increase the "out the door" price. And I make sure that the the dealer knows that I will walk away from the deal if the numbers are off at all.
So first, decide exactly what car you want, what trim level, what accessories, warranties, etc. Wait til the end of the month then call around to all the dealers within a reasonable distance and say "I'm buying a blue Accord EXL (or whatever) by the end of the month and I'm going to buy it from the dealer who gives me the best price by the close of business on [the day before the last day of the month], so I need to speak to someone who can give me your dealership's very best price." It turned out that the best price I got, almost $1,000 lower than the next best price, was from a dealer that was mentioned on this Board.
I hope this helps! Good luck.
#22703 of 32215 Re: Price of Accords went UP Dec 11th?? [nexofa]
Jan 21, 2009 (8:07 pm)
Each of your points were very clear and concise. I, too, agree with #1 which is why I was questioning it. With #2, after reading and learning about the "art of negotiating" I never truly looked at it from the other side. Of course the dealers know that we are researching (most of us anyway). You put this in great perspective for me.
And, most importantly, since this is not an "emotional" decision for me. One in which I don't mind walking away from, I will take your advice and rework my own numbers and start from the beginning with each dealer.
I thank you for your time in writing and explaining this information to me. It is greatly appreciated and extremely useful. Once a deal is struck I will write again to let you know how I made out. The only thing I need to remember is that patience is a virtue
#22704 of 32215 2009 Honda Accord EX-L 6 cyl with Navi
Jan 22, 2009 (4:30 am)
Hi - This is what I paid for my 2009 Honda Accord EX-L 6 cyl w/navi: $26,900 including destination fee. I bought it at Brewster Honda in NY. Used the link on this site to get in touch with their internet sales person and made the deal via emails. The salesperson is even delivering the car to me today so I don't have to drive an hour round trip to pick it up.
#22705 of 32215 Re: 2009 Honda Accord EX-L 6 cyl with Navi [aslave2fashion]
Jan 22, 2009 (8:37 am)
aslave: Same car for $26,366 at Boardwalk Honda just outside Atlantic City. More likely with a little arm twisting, the price could be brought down to an even $26,000.
#22706 of 32215 Re: Price of Accords went UP Dec 11th?? [nexofa]
Jan 22, 2009 (9:38 am)
"In today's business climate, I simply cannot believe that a car manufacturer would raise the prices of its cars to dealers, without a corresponding increase in rebates/givebacks/whatever. So technically Honda may have raised the "price" of the Accord, but the dealer isn't paying a dime more, net-net. In fact, interest rates have come down, and this is the worst car-buying market in years, and manufacturers have huge inventories, so if anything, the dealers are paying less. Just another dealer game to make you feel good about buying. Sorry to be so cynical."
You're not cynical - you're just WRONG. Feel free to come and look at the books, prices went up for dealers and consumers.
#22707 of 32215 Re: Price of Accords went UP Dec 11th?? [mplshondadlr]
Jan 22, 2009 (1:06 pm)
Well obviously I'm just speculating, but I doubt that any car company is raising its _net cost_ to dealers for cars (note the term "net"). Is that how Honda is dealing with the worst sales quarter and maybe the worst sales year ever (sales down 25-30% in the last quarter and 8% for the year)? By making it even harder for its dealers to sell the massive inventory sitting around? I doubt it. Credit crunch, recession, massive job losses, record foreclosures, and Honda alone raises its prices? C'mon. Show me something with a little more credibility than your "books".
And by "books", you mean the published prices that salespeople use to calculate their commissions, right? Or the books that show the so-called "dealer invoice" (which we all know is fiction)? You don't mean "books" as in financials, i.e balance sheets, profit/loss statements, cashflow statements, which would (or should) give a more complete picture of the relationship between a car dealership, manufacturer, and finance company. I'm guessing not too many people see those financials.
Any "price" increase in December by Honda is nothing more than a marketing tactic - "Look I'm giving you this car for $100 under invoice! OK if you buy today I'll make it $200 under invoice!! " or (in March) "We just dropped the price of Accords!" It's a marketing tactic like any other, to distract the buyer from the more relevant terms of the deal. It's all part of the game.
#22708 of 32215 Re: Price of Accords went UP Dec 11th?? [nexofa]
Jan 22, 2009 (1:51 pm)
Well it's obvious you're an expert. You're too smart for me. My grandpa once said, "Never argue with a fool because from a distance people can't tell who is who."
In the last year or so I have been sharing information here I have been very straight forward with this community. I share incentives before they are publised here or anywhere. I have broken down true net costs several times and have also provided advice on how to score a better deal.
As I said, since you're an expert when it comes to dealership workings, I'm just going to sit back and let you continue to share your misinformation with those who value insight. Good luck
#22709 of 32215 Re: Price of Accords went UP Dec 11th?? [mplshondadlr]
Jan 22, 2009 (2:33 pm)
OK truce. I meant nothing personal. Sorry if that last post sounded snarky. Really. You're doing a great service by sharing your perspective, and that's what's great about these boards. Your inside information about incentives is good stuff, so please don't stop on my account.
And I'm not claiming to be an expert. My only relevant experience is that 1) I just bought a 2009 Accord a couple weeks ago, and thanks to someone on this board, I got what appears to be a pretty good deal ($2,100 under the so-called dealer invoice), so I'm hoping I can help others do the same. And 2) I'm in Sales (software, not cars) so while shopping for and buying my car, I witnessed firsthand (and immediately recognized because they're so obvious!) the best and worst sales techniques out there, and I was just hoping to help others recognize what those tactics are, how not to fall for them, and how to get the best deal.
#22710 of 32215 Re: Price of Accords went UP Dec 11th?? [kiml4]
Jan 22, 2009 (5:17 pm)
This is simply wrong.
I have been shopping for my 09 Accord Coupe since early December - the price never changed and dealer incentives GOT BETTER on 1/3/09
I pulled the trigger and ordered my 09 Accord Coupe V6 EX-L 6 Speed w/Navi in Belize blue/black on 1/4/09 for $27.7k (inc dest) or $1200 under invoice.
Buying a Honda right now is real simple - get the invoice from KBB.com or Edmunds.com and shoot for $1000 or so below- you will get at least that.