Last post on Sep 17, 2007 at 5:06 PM
You are in the Mercedes Benz M-Class
What is this discussion about?
Mercedes-Benz M-Class, Ford Explorer, Buick Rendezvous, Acura MDX, Car Safety, Fuel Efficiency (MPG), SUV
Jul 27, 2003 (1:28 pm)
Value notwithstanding, the ML has turned out to be a POS and has hurt MB and their rep at least on this continent severely. I'm a fan of Mercedes, and wish they would just scrap the M and try again, and NOT with the G-500!
Jul 27, 2003 (2:03 pm)
I'm also a fan of Mercedes and BMW as well. I am afraid you are right, the ML has hurt MB and their rep on this continent severely. The X5 had its share of early production problem just like the ML, but the X5 was very well designed and engineered. The ML suffers from both production and design problems and it did not stand out in any particular area, it was a all around average suv. Mercedes in a way is very much like the new Cadillac, they built a very nice high end car but just dont know how to built a entry level car. The next ML will be redesign from the ground up, lets hope they learned a lesson from the first ML and spend a little more money on design and manufacturing engineering.
Jul 27, 2003 (3:06 pm)
Chrysler will probably become Mercedes' entry level name. Slowly, Mercedes engineering is being added to Chrysler cars (Pacifica has some and the Crossfire is basically a two seat C-Class with a different body and interior).
The ML competes against the Lexus small SUV in size and utility. It is an old design, long overdue for replacement. The bar has been raised substantially.
Adding Mercedes engineering to the DC Jeep line may be a better investment than trying to one up Lexus and Infinity in the luxury 5 seat SUV arena.
My entry level Mercedes, a Chrysler PT Cruiser GT, so far, has proven to be assembled better, more trouble free, and every bit as reliable as my MDX. Resale value may stink now, but I'm not planning on replacing it for years.
Jul 27, 2003 (6:25 pm)
And Cadillac's entry level name is Buick.
Jul 27, 2003 (7:23 pm)
And Lincoln's entry level car is Ford, and BMW's entry level car is.........oh, the well respected 3 series, at least for now. I hear a 1 series is coming.
So, if Chrysler is the entry level Mercedes, then why are they bringing over the A -Class? And what's with the C Class hatchback?
Jul 28, 2003 (9:01 am)
Still dont understand the logic behind the C Class Hatchback. You would think that Mercedes would have learned a lesson from the BMW 2 door hatchback that fail 4 or 5 years ago.
#450 of 473 Trade-in with TMV
Jul 29, 2003 (12:52 pm)
Dollar-wise depreciation matters more to me than percentage-wise depreciation. Cash value depreciation is comparable for MDX and RDV.
Also, with a more expensive vehicle you have a greater opportunity cost as more money is tied up in the car.
Here's an example on depreciation costs using the used TMV method with comparable features and parameters:
Back in 2002 I mainly compared a MDX Touring (no navigation) with a RDV CXL AWD, and bought the RDV for $10,000 less than the MDX.
Although the features are not exactly same, they are very close in both trims, hence the choices.
A 2002 MDX Touring cost new $38500 if you had the patience to wait for 5-10 months and pay MSRP. Now the excellent condition trade-in with 11K miles would bring $31642, a cash loss of $6858 (17.8%). The 2002 RDV cost me $28540 (MSRP 35150) and now would trade in for $21,004 in excellent condition with 11K miles. The cash loss is $7536 (26.4%).
Although RDV has depreciated more than MDX in the first year in percent, it cost about the same in dollars, plus I had the remaining $10,000 for other purposes.
My example with just 11000 miles and excellent condition for both vehicles may not apply to all cases. It is merely an illustration that the percentage-wise depreciation may be a misleading indicator as the actual loss is in the dollar value.
Jul 29, 2003 (1:59 pm)
My nephew just came by hopping mad about the $700 brake job his M-class just got at the MB dealer, and that's only the rear brakes. I told him, you can't have Falstaff, and have him thin. It costs more to drive a MB than it does the domestics. Particularly the M & E class, evidently.....
#452 of 473 RE: expensive brake jobs & other maintenance
Aug 01, 2003 (8:35 am)
In my neck of the woods, the stuff that one gets done at most EVERY dealership is vastly more expensive than that which gets done at a local shop or franchise type operation.
For some service items it may be worthwhile to use the dealer, as the skills & equipment that they have may make the job get done better and/or more quickly. Oil changes and brakes generally don't fall into that category.
I believe that MB, Acura, & BMW need not cost more to maintain than Ford or GM products IF you choose the service that you have done at the dealer wisely. Far too many folks drop their vehicles at the service department and accept whatever profit enhancing service/inspection the folks behind the counter will sell. Yes folks, they are SALESPEOPLE too! Just like a wise shopper wouldn't let a the new car saleperson soak 'em for mop n' glow or a can of fabric spray it is important that you authorize the SPECIFIC service you want done...
Aug 01, 2003 (1:28 pm)
You could make that case easily. But my experience could make the other as well. I find my Lincoln/Mercury dealer does not overcharge for brakes and routine service. They are high on things like belts, water pumps, alternators, that kind of thing but actually give the best deals on tires.
My friends with Mercedes products are chronically bemoaning the cost of parts & labor for their machines, from the $700 brake job to the $1500 oil changes. Clearly, they should stay away from the dealers for routine stuff.