Last post on Dec 30, 2011 at 9:54 AM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Toyota ECHO, Chevrolet Aveo, Kia Rio, Nissan Sentra, Honda Fit, Hyundai Accent, Toyota Yaris, Kia Spectra, Suzuki Forenza, Sedan
Sep 04, 2001 (9:33 am)
You guys have been busy...
major... which article are you referring to that rated the Protege ES 0-60mph in 8.9 seconds. The 1999 Protege ES review of Car and Driver November 1998 clocked the Protege with an 8.4 second run to 60mph. I'd post a link, but the Edmunds software throws a fit about the character count.
Who said Mazda sales are down? As of July 2001, year-over-year sales have increased 10.6%, led by a strong 8.6% increase in Protege sales and a whopping 54.2% in Millenia sales.
Protege a BMW? No. But, Car and Driver said, "This Mazda tops the charts for driving fun. Its chassis muscles are athletic, its engine is sweet and strong, its controls are precise and direct, and the look is classy inside and out. This is a car that does everything well. And it has spirit. BMW verve for less than half the price. What's not to like?" Again, I'd post a link but this character limit!!! Anyways, it was from their "Little Cars 6.1" comparison test of June 2000. They tested 13 sedans equipped with 5-spd transmissions and 16-valve DOHC 4-cyl engines. The price cap was set at $16,000. Wanna see how they ranked?
13. Kia Sephia LS
12. Daewoo Nubira CDX
10. Toyota Echo (tie)
10. Suzuki Esteem 1.8GLX Sport (tie)
9. Saturn SL2
8. Mitsubishi Mirage DE
7. Chevrolet Prizm
6. Hyundai Elantra GLS
5. Dodge Neon ES
4. Honda Civic LX
3. Ford Focus ZTS
2. Nissan Sentra GXE
1. Mazda Protege ES
Sephia as reliable as Honda, Toyota, Mazda, Nissan? One quick perusal through the Sephia board will make you think otherwise. But be forewarned... its a battle-ground in there.
Sep 04, 2001 (10:10 am)
Jstand, my info comes from the Road Test Digest found in most issues of Car And Driver. For the Mazda Protege ES featured in the June of 2000, article, they came up with the figures I gave.
Sep 04, 2001 (10:20 am)
Ahhh... Yes, the 1999 model is the quickest of all the Protege's (except for the 2001 MP3). Each year, it has grown in weight as more features are piled on. The 2001's required the bigger engine as they had piled on about 300 pounds since 1999. BTW, I have been hearing quite strongly that Mazda will introduce a smaller vehicle (smaller than Protege) which will probably be a hatchback. It's supposed to launch in about two years. Power will be provided by a 1.5L DOHC DI (Direct Injection) S-VT (Sequential Valve Timing) 4-cyl that should compete directly with the smaller sub-compacts such as the Accent. I would imagine it will be pricier, but should start around $10k.
Sep 04, 2001 (10:22 am)
Automotive News has an interview with the head of Hyundai of America.
He stated that Hyundai will not leave the low end market, but that they will be taking steps to differentiate Hyundai and Kia.
He also stated that the long haul warranty is in for the long haul. Only time will tell if this holds true. From a business standpoint, if reducing it will not mean a loss of sales, the smart thing would be to cut it down.
Sep 04, 2001 (10:26 am)
Would the poster (Frank?) who first brought up the sales figures provide a link to where he got the information for Toyota? I tried using the search button of AOL; I tried searching Automotive News; and, I tried searching on Toyota.com. Nothing I did met with any success.
Sep 04, 2001 (10:41 am)
I agree that a 6'3" person would find "comfort" to hold a different meaning than someone who is 5'8" or someone who is 6'0" (me although I can reach 6'1" if I stand up really straight).
However, where did the poster who brought up this point seemingly get the idea that all the testers from Consumer Report are 5'8"?
Tester height is mentioned by Consumer Reports, but that is in relation to headroom. Consumer Reports states that headroom is how much room there is above a 5'9" tester's head.
Consumer Reports says that there is 4.5"s of headroom in the Echo. This is one area I must disagree with Consumer Reports on. If you add the 5'9" height of the tester to the 4.5"s of headroom, you come up with 6'.5". This seems to indicate that a person a shade over 6' would find himself brushing the ceiling. I am a shade over 6' as I said and I still feel like I have plenty of headroom. Perhaps my having long legs has something to do with it.
And I would say that weight also plays a big part in terms of comfort.
Personally, I find my Echo to be very comfortable.
Sep 04, 2001 (10:53 am)
I agree that speed is relative, but we are talking about low end cars as they relate to each other and not how they relate to a Ferrari or other speed demon.
I think the speed champ of low end cars would have to be the Neon. I say this based on what I am reading right now.
AutoWeek's The 2001 Ultimate Buyer's Guide indicates that the 132hp, manual transmission Neon (not Neon R/T or Neon ACR) they tested did 0 to 60 in 7.94 seconds and the quarter in 16.12 seconds. The base price was around $12,500.
Can anyone find a faster low end car?
Sep 04, 2001 (11:26 am)
It is true that Car And Driver compared the Protege with a BMW. A BMW of the past though. In the September issue of C&D is a review of the Protege MP3.
C&D has this to say about the Protege, "The Protege has long been a favorite around these parts. The last-generation car clobbered 12 other compact sedans in our "Little Cars 6.1" comparo in June 2000 with its fair impersonation of a BMW 2002."
To me this says that C&D is NOT comparing the Protege with a MODERN day BMW of ANY kind.
#537 of 3871 re: Protege v. BMW...
Sep 04, 2001 (1:42 pm)
Ah, but it their "Little Cars 6.1" comparo, they did say the Protege has, "BMW verve for less than half the price." Towards the end of the aritcle, they say about the Protege, "There aren't many sedans at any price that can match the dynamic balance of this Mazda, that possess the quick, confident moves and the carved-from-billet integrity of structure." How often do you hear praise like that about an economy car? Probably the last time was the early 90's Sentra SE-R. However, being semi-compared to a BMW is a whole lot better than one of the other brands (I won't mention which one, but I think we know) being compared to a used car.
Sep 04, 2001 (3:04 pm)
Backy, where did you get those sales figures? Autonews.com has the YTD sales figures on their website right now. Those figures run contrary to what you posted.
American Honda is UP 2.6%.
Mazda is UP 9.3%.
Mitsubishi is down 3.6%.
Nissan is down 9.5%.
Subaru is UP 6.8%.
Suzuki is UP 3.9%.
Toyota is UP 6.4%.
Now Backy may claim that his figures for the above makers do not include anything but passenger cars. However, Kia and Hyundai both sell non-car vehicles so if the sales figures for them include these vehicles, then the sales figures for the others must include sales of any non-car vehicles.
So Backy, your response?