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Low End Sedans (under $16k)

3871 messages,  Last post on Dec 30, 2011 at 10:54 AM

You are in the Sedans Forum.

What is this discussion about? Toyota ECHO, Chevrolet Aveo, Kia Rio, Nissan Sentra, Honda Fit, Hyundai Accent, Toyota Yaris, Kia Spectra, Suzuki Forenza, Sedan

Messages Page 325 of 388

#3233 of 3871 micweb... by iluvmysephia1

Oct 12, 2005 (9:50 am)

I am one who chooses not to immerse myself into speculating on just how an accident might go down. I choose to buy the type of car I like and then drive the car responsibly, at all times and in all weather conditions. I realize that some moron could plow head on into me some dark night or even in broad daylight, but it wouldn't happen without me trying to evade it. I have read too many write-ups on deflection angles messing up crash-tests from test-to-test and them not being able to replicate crash test angles, etc. It seems the science is unsteady and unreliable. I think I understand GM's stance in this problem.
 
Having said that, I will keep in mind the information on SAC's and their importance in stopping accident injuries. When it comes time to trade in I am still not sure I would hold up on a deal if the rig doesn't have SAB's and SAC's. Maybe I will be convinced of their importance for sure by then, I'm not saying I won't be.
 
In my mind the 2006 Kia Rio and soon-to-be-released 2006 Hyundai Accent (and, of course, the next-size car up) are the size I would feel safer in than in the 2007 Toyota Yaris or the new Nissan Versa, etc. If I wanted to buy one of those cars I would demand the car have SAB's and SAC's.

#3234 of 3871 wait, by alpha01

Oct 12, 2005 (11:07 am)

The Yaris and Versa arent going to be smaller than the Rio and Accent, so Im not sure I follow.

#3235 of 3871 Re: micweb... [iluvmysephia1] by micweb

Oct 12, 2005 (1:13 pm)

Replying to: iluvmysephia1 (Oct 12, 2005 9:50 am)
You said, in part:
 
In my mind the 2006 Kia Rio and soon-to-be-released 2006 Hyundai Accent (and, of course, the next-size car up) are the size I would feel safer in than in the 2007 Toyota Yaris or the new Nissan Versa, etc. If I wanted to buy one of those cars I would demand the car have SAB's and SAC's.
 
Well then,
 
You're problem is solved, because the Accent and Rio have standard SAB's and SAC's!
 
[And the rest of us are waiting to see what happens with the Yaris and Fit.]

#3236 of 3871 alpha01... by iluvmysephia1

Oct 12, 2005 (8:54 pm)

true, for some reason I envisioned the re-designed Rio and Accent as being bigger cars than Yaris and Fit.
 
I see only pictures of the Yaris on the web and it looks really small and the re-designed '06 Kia Rio looks like a bigger rig to me than the Yaris/Versa/Fit-mobiles. I haven't actually compared their dimensions.
 
As micweb has already said, if I wanted to get an Accent or Rio my problem is solved as they both come standard with bags fit into every nook and cranny.
 
I don't know why the Rio seems so much more substantial a car than the Yaris. Maybe it's those stamped mouldings everywhere! Extra protection dont'cha'know.
 
The new Rio looks great in black, I've added it to my futures list, the sedan version of the '06 Rio no less.

#3237 of 3871 Re: alpha01... [iluvmysephia1] by alpha01

Oct 12, 2005 (9:56 pm)

Replying to: iluvmysephia1 (Oct 12, 2005 8:54 pm)
I dont understand your posts sometimes. You flat out state that you havent compared dimensions of the vehicles, just simply that one subjectively looks bigger than the other from photos you've seen. So, exactly what point are you making?
 
Given your history of posts, I think part of the reason that the Rio seems more substantial than the Yaris for you is that you think pretty much exclusively in terms of the Koreans.
 
Why not go in with a blank slate, since you yourself said you havent looked at any factual information? (And I doubt you've had the chance to see the Yaris in person). Have you driven the Rio yet? What did you think?
 
One area where Hyundai/Kia need to continue to make strides: fuel efficiency. The new 110 horse Accent and Rio cant manage better ratings than the 126 horse Corolla, and only tie the ratings of the 140 horse Civic. I would expect that the Yaris and Fit, if not the Versa with its fairly large 1.8L engine, will significantly trounce those two.
 
~alpha

#3238 of 3871 Re: alpha01... [alpha01] by backy

Oct 12, 2005 (10:13 pm)

Replying to: alpha01 (Oct 12, 2005 9:56 pm)
How do the mpg ratings of the Scions compare to those of the Corolla? Shouldn't these smaller, lighter cars with lower-power engines do better in fuel economy than the Corolla?
 
I don't think you'll see a huge bump in fuel economy for the small-engined Hyundais and Kias until the all-new I4 engine family comes online. Note that the fuel economy of the first of these new I4s to come out, the 2.4L 162 hp unit used in the '06 Sonata, has competitive fuel economy numbers to Honda and Toyota engines. So there's hope for the smaller engines.

#3239 of 3871 If fuel economy were my pet concern... by iluvmysephia1

Oct 12, 2005 (10:29 pm)

that would be news. I am one who happens to have bought two Kia's in a row and really prefers the body styling of the Korean cars over the Japanese. I look at the Japanese cars each passing year to see if one of them is good enough to pull me away from the Korean HyunKia machine. Haven't seen it yet and as time goes on I don't think they're gonna be able to do it. Fuel economy alone doesn't dictate what I want and need and love about a vehicle. When I was originally in the Kia dealer buying my '99 Sephia I read every board up in the showroom comparing the Sephia to the Civic and Corolla, thoroughly. I bought one and I love what I got for my money.
 
The Korean cars are heavy, that hurts their fuel economy a tad. Big deal? Not a big enough deterrrent to South Korean cars. My '01 Sportage finally wore out it's original equipment tires at 101,000 miles. Over a hundred thousand big ones on OEM tires? I still can't believe it. No blowouts along the way, either. I haven't had to replace a single light bulb or headlight bulb yet and the Sportsman is at 105, 035 miles as I type this post out. Not a single bulb blown out!
 
Now, I know, I haven't ever bought or even test drove a RAV4 before, but there's no way that the RAV4 would've gone 105, 035 miles without a single light bulb being blown out. No way-not gonna ride with any of y'all on that one if you try and tell me that. These Korean cars are good, not just kinda good, they are very, very, very good cars.
 
Yep, the benchmark in my view is the Korean automobile, not the Japanese. They overthrew the Japanese cars 2 or 3 years ago. And they continue to improve with every model. Car reviews don't work unless I experience the wonderment myself.
 
If you wanna know the truth there are boatloads of Americans who are always going into everything with a blankslate. Including driving safety and the good driving habits every licensed driver should have. Don't tell me that you, alpha01, are one of the millions of Americans who no longer feels it matters if they signal their intention to change lanes any more. What a pathetic, lazy nation this nation has become. Cell phones on, brains turned off. I'm not saying you are one, alpha01, just let me know honestly that you signal your intention to change lanes each and every change. Tell me that you do, please. Yep, boatloads of Americans that blindly believe all the car reviews and car magazines that are telling them that the Japanese makers do it best, bar none. A very effective brainwashing that is nauseatingly successful. That grip is fading now, if the American people keep their brainwaves receptive and available, uh-huh. My '01 Sportage 4x4 at idle purrs so quietly, at 105, 035 miles, that I think I have to re-start the car if it's been running for a long time and I'm sitting in the cab and want to go again. It is very quiet and fakes me into thinking that it's not running when it is. I could go on and on, but I won't. Your turn.
 
Feel free to provide more pro-Japanese car propaganda. I'm all ears. Right.

#3240 of 3871 Re: alpha01... [alpha01] by bamacar

Oct 13, 2005 (4:23 am)

Replying to: alpha01 (Oct 12, 2005 9:56 pm)
It appears from the Canadian estimates that the Yaris gets worse mileage on the highway than the Corolla and slightly better in the city. My guess for the EPA is 39/33 or 40/33 for the Yaris. Good but definitely not Echo good. Beats the Rio, but it appears that airbags will be an option and not standard, no 5 door, and options look pricey (Canada). I hope the Fit gets better mpg numbers and has a model that comes standard with the extras that made the Echo overpriced compared with the Corolla. The Rio with reasonable highway gearing on the manual transmission should have gotten 40mpg especially with the auto getting 38. That would have made it about equal to the upcoming Yaris in the mpg departement.

#3241 of 3871 Re: If fuel economy were my pet concern... [iluvmysephia1] by alpha01

Oct 13, 2005 (6:41 am)

Replying to: iluvmysephia1 (Oct 12, 2005 10:29 pm)
Your last paragraph is somewhat of a personal affront that I consider off-topic and inappropriate, but Im not the host. I'm not sure what signaling has to do with small car purchase decisions, but for the record, I do signal about 9 in 10 times, basically anytime there is another car on the road/near me. Your Sportage experience is anecdotal, and also irrelevant in a discussion of 16K economy sedans. And as for my pro-Japanese propoganda, well, ignorance does breed humor, as I just went on a rant in the Camry v. Accord v. Sonata v. Fusion thread how the Sonata is a great car, at/near the top of its class, and I'd choose one over the Camry this very day.
 
Iluvmysephia, simply put, you have a profound bias toward Korean products, and defend them endlessly. Trust me, Im not saying I'm unbiased, just that I'm a lot LESS biased than are you. And really, theres nothing wrong with your bias, but there is something wrong with trying to pass off that bias as fact, which I feel you do frequently.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------
Finally, I was not saying that fuel economy is your primary concern. I was simply stating that it is one area where the Korean makes have lagged. As backy noted, the Sonata's numbers are promising, for the future, but the Accent/Rio's arent as I high as I would expect from engines generating 110 horses, and the ECONOMY CLASS OF VEHICLE has historically placed a strong value on fuel consumption. My expectation is that the Yaris and Fit, possibly the Versa... will provide a better power/efficiency profile than do the Accent and Rio. Thats all.
 
backy- the Scions are underpowered and geared to compensate, adversly affecting fuel consumption.they are also not the most aerodynamic examples. Despite their low price tags, I would not buy the xA or xB for that reason. Why buy a slow vehicle with middling efficiency to boot? The tC is a different story, that one I'd buy, even though its only rated at 23/30, I believe. (The 5M is pretty fleet at 7.4 to 60 as timed by Car and Driver. )
 
~alpha

#3242 of 3871 Re: If fuel economy were my pet concern... [alpha01] by backy

Oct 13, 2005 (6:57 am)

Replying to: alpha01 (Oct 13, 2005 6:41 am)
Scion xA
Curb weight: 2340/2380 (manual/auto)
EPA: 32/37, 31/38 (manual/auto)
HP: 103
 
Kia Rio
Curb weight: 2365/2403 (manual/auto)
EPA: 32/35, 29/38 (manual/auto)
HP: 110
 
There doesn't seem to be a big difference between the xA and the Kia Rio. The Rio appears to be geared to wring performance out of its small engine also. Why is that an excuse for the Scion not matching the larger Corolla's fuel economy, but it's not acceptable for the Kia (or similar Accent)?
 
I don't see where the small difference, if any, between the xA and Rio in aerodynamics has much to do with the fuel economy numbers, which are measured at relatively low speeds.
 
The tC isn't a car in this discussion.

Messages Page 325 of 388

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