Last post on Dec 09, 2013 at 10:06 PM
You are in the Prices Paid - Buying & Leasing Experiences
What is this discussion about?
Honda Civic CRX, Honda Civic, Honda Civic del Sol, Coupe, Hatchback, Sedan
#10446 of 10743 Re: $18k for a '13 LX Auto-goo price? [jipster]
Mar 14, 2013 (6:01 am)
Yeah, I was one of those that "considered the Elantra the better car" too and was set on buying one.
Until I drove one.
Compared to the Honda, in my opinion, the Elantra felt much less refined. The engine did not feel as smooth, the way the gas pedal felt under my foot felt more "crunchy". The power steering felt rough. When I test drove the Civic, I could not get over how smooth it felt. The 1.8L engine purred almost as if it were electric, the power steering felt like it was riding on glass bearings (smooth and effortless) and the feel of the gas pedal under my foot was as if it were built on ball bearings. Smooth. Everything felt refined and smooth in the Honda. It was a nice reassuring feeling.
What really hit home with me was when I popped the trunk on the Elantra. Whereas the Honda Civic LX I was looking at had a jack, tire iron and donut spare, the Elantra had: a can of tire goo. Yep, that's right. No spare, not even a donut, just a can of tire goo. Beautiful. I can just picture myself on a dark highway somewhere in the middle of the night relying on this. Forget about getting home, I'd be amazed if it got me to the nearest gas station without riding on the rim.
So yeah, Hyundai gives you all sorts of bells and whistles. But if you think Hyundai is bringing you the mystical "free lunch", think again because I believe you are kidding yourself. They are cutting corners elsewhere under the hood and in the car to make up for those features and fabulous price, you just need to look closer to see it.
Oh and one more thing that weighed heavily in my decision. The Honda 1.8L delivers at or better than its EPA numbers. It does not take a trained monkey with a feather on the accelerator to achieve it. Just Google what Hyundai tried to pull last year with its EPA numbers on the Elantra and other vehicles, and how folks were reporting "distorted" mpgs from their onboard computers compared to old-fashioned calculations. And check out how Hyundai settled the matter. This whole affair left me with a distaste for Hyundai and the way they treated those customers who actually thought they were buying vehicles that were going to get somewhere near 38 or 40mpg.
I would have seriously considered the Nissan Sentra and in fact the very lovely Nissan Altima. I already have two older Nissan Sentras in the family. Except for three little letters now found in almost all new Nissan vehicles: C-V-T.
Do some research into how well Nissan CVT transmissions are holding up, especially if you plan to hold onto the car, and what it costs to repair (rather I should say REPLACE) them. Your eyes will pop out of your head, as did mine. I quickly came to the conclusion that I am going to let other folks ride out the current crop of CVT transmissions for another vehicle generation before I touch it. In fact, my hesitation with regard to CVT reliability is what caused me to go with the Civic instead of the 4-cyl 2013 Honda Accord, which is really a nice vehicle too. So given that Nissan has almost completely migrated to CVTs in their cars, unless I wanted the base Sentra with a manual the Sentra was out for me.
I also looked at the Mazda 323, which was a very pleasurable vehicle to drive, a real hoot. But I am 6'1" 185 lbs and I felt "funneled" and cramped in the front seat, and getting in and out of the rear seats was like playing a game of Twister each time. I had to make sure my feet were positioned just right in order to get them in and out of the rear footwells. As an overall vehicle, the Mazda was great for the driving experience but not nearly as comfortable to me as the Civic was.
At the end of the day, I firmly believe that for an ALL AROUND reliable and pleasurable compact sedan, the 2013 Civic, while not perfect by any means, was the best choice for me.
#10447 of 10743 Re: $18k for a '13 LX Auto-goo price? [stiletto_dude]
Mar 14, 2013 (7:08 am)
I did drive the sentra and altima. Personally, the CVT on the Altima is better than the Sentra. As soon as I drove off the dealer lot during my test drive of the Sentra and stepped on the gas pedal, I could hear the loud drone sound of the CVT. I just couldn't deal with it. The sentra did have great rear leg room and trunk space..I'd say best in it's class. However, the ride quality wasn't as great.
the 2013 civic ride quality is much better than the sentra. For me the ride quality matters as I keep my cars for over 10 years and want to be happy with what I end up buying.
I also test drove the Accord CVT and the 2014 mazda 6. The 6 is definitely a driver's car. Since there are only a few available on dealer lots, the price for a auto isport (base trim) is close to $22k. I am not sure I want to spend that price for a mazda 6 regardless of how great it drives.
#10448 of 10743 Re: $18k for a '13 LX Auto-goo price? [jipster]
Mar 14, 2013 (7:09 am)
The doc fee is $200
#10449 of 10743 Re: $18k for a '13 LX Auto-goo price? [stiletto_dude]
Mar 14, 2013 (7:29 am)
Opinions are like rectums...everyone has one! We have a cvt in my kids Versa SL and it's great and reliable. Will have to try the new Civic but if it's anything like my '06, I'll choose the Elantra and Sentra over the Civic any day of the week. Glad you like your Civic!
#10450 of 10743 Re: $18k for a '13 LX Auto-goo price? [ashjaw]
Mar 15, 2013 (10:22 am)
I just bought a 2013 Civic EX a few days ago and I'm located in King of Prussia, just outside of Philadelphia.
What I did was google mapped every Honda dealer within 50 miles of me, which encompasses from Jersey all the way to Reading, Lehigh Valley, and of course Philadelphia.
I then emailed the following to every one of the 'Internet Sales Managers' that I could find for each dealer:
At 5pm today I will be buying a 2013 Honda Civic EX, either crystal black or alabaster silver exterior, with gray interior. I will be buying it from the dealer that responds with the best 'out the door' price (including all taxes, tags, and any other costs) by 5pm today. Please provide your best price.
I also had to call a bunch of the dealerships because I couldn't find email addresses for them. Surprisingly, the sales folks didn't try to keep me on the line long - they would just take my request and then say they'd call back shortly. Most did call back with a price within the hour.
Later that day, out of the ~20 area Honda dealerships on my spreadsheet, I had it narrowed down to three with the best price: Sloane up in Northeast Philadelphia, Conicelli in Conshohocken, and Piazza in Pottstown/Limerick. Sloane and Conicelli had the lowest price. The out the door pricing ranged from $22,075 down to the lowest (Conicelli and Sloane's price) - $20,987.
I then took the $20,987 email from Conicelli's internet manager and brought it to Piazza Limerick and talked to a really sleazy salesman there. They wanted $200 more and wouldn't match Conicelli/Sloane.
It was then that I told him I had a trade-in - a 2001 Accord VP with 103k miles and a bad transmission that's been slipping forever. They offered me $2500 for it, but when I balked they went up to $2700 and said they woulnd' tgo any higher because of the transmission (they caught it - I didn't tell them about the tranny).
So I then took that $20,987 and $2700 trade in to Conicelli. I asked Conicelli to tell me what they'd offer for the trade-in. They offered $1800. After a few minutes they matched the $2700 and a deal was struck.
This is pretty common knowledge on the internet but just in case: always negotiate the trade in separately, as I did above.
So, currently in the Philly area, the best price I could get was $20,987 out the door for an EX, in any color I wanted. Keep in mind that is for a car registered in the Philly suburbs, so 2% cheaper taxes than what a car registered in Philly would be.
If you'd like my spreadsheet (it's actually in Evernote, not Excel), I'm happy to share.
I realize you wanted an LX. I did get some dealers that sent me a list that included LX pricing. The best of that bunch was $17988 for a 2013 LX out the door from Piazza Honda of Philadelphia. In fact, if you ask nicely, I could send you the email he sent that contains the internet pricing for all their Hondas.
Mar 15, 2013 (10:24 am)
Just realized that that $17988 for the LX was the vehicle price and not the all inclusive 'out the door' price. That adds another ~$1400.
Suggestion: don't even bother worrying about 'vehicle price'. It's meaningless. Force them to focus on only two simple numbers, separately: 'out the door' price and trade-in (if you have one). That's it. The rest is all meant to confuse.
#10452 of 10743 Re: CORRECTION [mark2741]
Mar 15, 2013 (11:11 am)
Thanks for that excellent detailed account of your approach, mark2741.
I followed a similar approach down here in Georgia, working about 14 dealers. I ended up getting a 2013 LX Sedan for $18,978 OTD including everything. I already detailed how that number is arrived at in a previous post in case anyone in interested.
Could I have done better on a 2013 LX Sedan? Maybe. But I arrived at the point that none of the other dealers in my area would touch $18,978 OTD.
#10453 of 10743 Re: $18k for a '13 LX Auto-goo price? [mark2741]
Mar 15, 2013 (12:57 pm)
Thanks for the detailed post. yes, if you can share the email and the spreadsheet, it will be super helpful. cnj.07080 at gmail dot com
#10454 of 10743 HONDA CIVIC LX AUTO SEDAN
Mar 15, 2013 (5:55 pm)
BOUGHT A CIVIC LX AUTO SEDAN,OTD FOR 19300,NO DEALER INSTALLED ACCESORIES.LOS ANGELES COUNTY.2 WEEKS AGO.
#10455 of 10743 Re: $18k for a '13 LX Auto-goo price? [ashjaw]
Mar 16, 2013 (6:23 pm)