Last post on Jun 18, 2013 at 11:59 AM
You are in the Prices Paid - Buying & Leasing Experiences
What is this discussion about?
Mercedes-Benz E-Class, Sedan, Wagon
#1318 of 1986 Re: Buy/Lease/Sport/Luxury ...? [lawcar]
Dec 22, 2011 (6:15 pm)
You pose some very interesting questions, however more information is needed in order to give you a proper response:
*How many miles do you drive in a year? That is needed for lease vs. purhase. If you drive 15000 miles per year, that means in 36 months, you will have driven 45,000 miles. Remember, your warranty is for 50,000 miles. Of course you can purchase the extended warranty, which I have because the dealer threw it in as part of the deal after negotiations were finalized. Definitely worth the bucks if you are going to keep the car for 4 or 5 years.
If you drive 15,000 miles a year, I would lease since the company is paying for the car. If you drive 10,000 miles per year, I would buy. If you keep the car for 5 years (if you buy) you would be able to get a good resale due to lower mileage.
*Sport vs. Luxury: I'm 67 years old and have always bought a sport E350. To me, handling and performance outweigh softer and looser. I used to buy BMW's, so I am familiar with your comparison. I know you will find the Merecedes is far superior in every way.
The dealer was correct that 9 out of every 10 E350 sedans sold is a sport. There are shortcomings to the sport - tire and wheel sizes are not the same front to rear, so you cannot rotate tires; the sport is slightly lower in stance so if you park in an area where there are front curbs for the nose of the car, be careful not to pull too close or you will scrape the bottom of the lower front of the car; interior is slightly different - more aluminum and chrome trim in the sport. I still prefer the sport because of the stiffer feel and better handling.
*The 1.9% financing rate (can negotiate a lower rate, I got 1.6%) is a truly outstanding interest rate for a Mercedes, expecially considering you can extend the loan to 66 months.
*Your sales person is not well informed about leasing. If you drive 18,000 to 20,000 miles per year, your leased vehicle would be out of warranty within 2 1/2 years. If you drive 12,000 miles a year or even 15,000 miles a year, your car would be covered for the term of the 36 month lease. Again, need to know how many miles you drive a year to give you better answers.
*Options: For most, Premium 1 package is more than sufficient. My 2012 is the first one I"ve had with Premium 2, but since I drive alot at night, those Xenon lights, corning lights and adaptive lighting package are a great addition. I also thought the automatic trunk closer from the rear was a waste, but, since having it, I use it all the time. You have two buttons, one to just close the trunk, the other to close the trunk and "lock the car and set the alarm". Whenever we go shopping for groceries, it sure is a handy feature. I also like the keyless entry and start - never have to fumble around looking for my key. So long as I have it in my pocket, I'm set.
But I was very happy with premium 1. Since I live in Florida, I also got the ventilated seats (which require leather seating, another 1600+ option). Boy, they really cool your back and bottom quickly on a hot, muggy day, which we have here 7 months a year. We haven't used the heated seats with ventilation yet, but I would imagine up north, they sure are great. Other than these, sounds like you are getting what you need.
*As for overthinking, remember as we get older, we tend not to make snap decisions as we did when we were younger. We think things out before making a move. YOu are only doing what most of us do.
Once we know how many miles you drive, the answer to leasing vs. buying will be easier to advise you on.
#1319 of 1986 Re: Interesting forum, but a few things to add [kevinc5]
Dec 22, 2011 (6:45 pm)
Inventory management is always a consideration, i.e. floor plan (which are interest costs the dealer has to deal with for the money he borrowed from the bank(s) and/or the manufacturer to purchase the cars he has in inventory. The higher the inventory, the more interest that hs to be paid - but with interest rates so low at the present time, I doubt inventory management had much to do with it, if anything.
As for low inventories to increase pricing, any dealer would rather sell 2000 cars a year with a total front and back end profit of 2000 than to sell 1000 cars with total profit on each sale of 3000, or even 4000. Dealers who sell more cars are considered "favored" dealers by their manufacturers and get more corporate perks. Each dealer pays the same for a car, no matter how big or small the dealer may be, but there are additional incentives "per car" that are provided, above and beyond hold-back.
Believe it or not, because of sites such as Edmunds, Cars.com, Vehix, etc., I have learned that many dealers are offering customers "The Edmunds Pricing" to start negotiations or the "Cars.com Pricing".
Edmunds shows you what the average buyer is paying for a particular car with specific options, once you build your car on Edmunds. So, some dealers have decided on this new policy to cut down on the time it takes to negotiate a deal. When I was n the business, it could take up to 3 hours of hard negotiations to arrive at a price (not all were that long, but the average was 1 1/2 to 2 hours). Now, when a sales person presents their first penciled numbers, they start at MSRP and show the customer the Edmunds price. Their pitch is simple, this is what the average person is actually paying for this car according to Edmunds. They even show the Edmunds fact sheet which is shown online. Once dealer told me theya have cut the time it takes to negotiate a deal by 70%. That makes the customer happier and of course, it makes life easier for the management and salesperson.
Let's assume an average Lexus GS350 MSRP's at about 53,000.00. Let's say Edmunds shows that the average price paid for that identical dealer is $51,000. But let's say the customer says he wants a better deal than the average customer. So, they take another 500 off the price which makes the customer happier. There is still a profit of 2000+ on the car for the dealer, and negotiations were pleasant instead of causing hate and discontent.
Of course, there are so many people using sites like Edmunds prior to purchasing a car that it is almost impossible to make big profits on cars today. It's volume that is important to a dealership now for the above reasons. Many managers and sales people tell me that customers are starting to come into the dealership offering "invoice" for the car and not a penny more. Those are the most difficult customers to deal with because they are inflexible. A dealer cannot sell all his cars at invoice - he'd be out of business in less than a year. He can sell some cars at invoice, and even a few below invoice, but it's the average net profit that management looks at.
Dealers know that they are not going to sell a Toyota or a Lexus for MSRP. So why not cut to the chase. Consumers are smarter now because of sites like Edmunds and Forums like this.
Just thought you might find this interesting, Kevin.
#1320 of 1986 Re: Buy/Lease/Sport/Luxury ...? [lawcar]
Dec 22, 2011 (8:25 pm)
Now that Mike has weighed in and voted for Sport, I guess it's my turn to speak up and vote Luxury! OK, really, they're both great and you can't really screw up this decision. But....I owned a Luxury first....then went to the Sport....and am now awaiting delivery of a '12 Luxury model. I'm 54, a woman. While the sport ride is definitely fun, the BIG difference for me was the noise. The low profile tires are definitely louder. The Luxury cabin has a much quieter ride, in my opinion. I've also stepped up to the P2 this time--in large part for the headlight package. It's not getting any easier driving at night, so this seemed like a smart move for a car I plan to keep for awhile. And to Mike's point about the lower front end, I can speak from experience on that one. That scraping sound over the curb is a killer. Haven't done serious damage but have scraped it more than once. It's deceivingly low. Each model has some spectacular features. You'll love either---promise. Good luck!
#1321 of 1986 Re: Thanks, Mike.
Dec 22, 2011 (10:51 pm)
Thanks for sharng your experience and suggestions. I drive 12,000 miles per year. The lower profile is a real factor, as the curb in front of our house is high, and I've dinged my BMW up when I wasn't as careful as I should be.
#1322 of 1986 Thanks, Bev...
Dec 22, 2011 (10:56 pm)
Thanks for sharing your experience. I didn't notice the louder noise when I test drove the Sport, but it was only for about 10 minute test drive. I did notice the difference in the feel of the cars. The lower profile is a consideration, as I've scraped my BMW on my front curb when I wasn't careful. The pros and cons of the Sport and Luxury is one reason to lease to see how I like the car.
#1324 of 1986 Re: Color combo question...
Dec 22, 2011 (11:18 pm)
You mentioned that the single largest determinant of trade-in/resale will be color combo and condition. MB doesn't make weird colors and I was curious as to which color combos you had in mind. Thanks.
#1325 of 1986 Re: Thanks, Bev... [lawcar]
Dec 23, 2011 (7:06 am)
Quite frankly, I would not rush into leasing. Here is the reason:
If your company is going to lease or purchase the car under the company's name, etc., then leasing is the best way to go. If you are leasing or buying the car in your own name with the company reimbursing you for the cost of either, then BUY the car!
Remember, over a period of say 3 years, which is the usual length of most leases, your company has reimbursed you for 3 years worth of payments (if you buy the car) which has built equity in the car. I don't know how long you or your company had planned to take to pay off the loan on the car. But doesn't it make sense that after the 3 year period, you have accumulated equity in the car, but in a lease, you have nothing at lease end. So long as you are not paying for the car out of your own pocket, it pays to buy the car.
As you mentioned, if you don't like the car and you are in a lease, it will cost you dearly to get out of the lease. If you buy the car, you can trade it or sell it anytime you want.
If you are looking for a car that handles like your 528i did (I owned a 525 and two 535i's) then you must get the sport. If you are looking for a softer ride that is a little quieter, then get the luxury. I also want to add that the resale value on a sport vs. a luxury (if you buy) will be a bit higher (not 5,000 higher, but a little higher) because most Mercedes Benz E350 sedans are sports because that is what the demand is!
Bev is correct that you will be happy with either one. The choice should be on what you want or need, not what your would settle for!
Again, if you want a car that will corner better and respond more quickly to your input, the Sport is what you should get. If you are more concerned about a softer ride and handling and cornering are less of a concern, then you should get the luxury.
#1326 of 1986 Re: Color combo question... [lawcar]
Dec 23, 2011 (7:16 am)
Hope you don't mind adding my 2 cents worth, but I believe what he was trying to convey is that certain colors are more desirable than others.
Here is an example:
In a Mercedes Benz (not necessarily in other brands), Black is the most desirable on the pre-owned market, so long as it isn't scratched, dinged or scraped. The next most desirable color is Iridium Silver followed by Palladium Silver, followed by White. Those four colors are the most demanded colors. The dark blue and light blue are less desirable as is the dark gray. The least desirable is that new Beige color they brought in when they introduced the new body design in 2010 which replaced Pewter.
This info was given to me by my dealerships Used Car Manager.
Another consideration is the exterior vs. the interior colors. If you have a silver car with a beige interior, the value will drop considerably. Gray and Black interiors are preferred with Gray and Black cars. In a Beige car, black is the least desirable interior.
So, as you can see, exterior and interior colors do have an impact on the trade value of a Mercedes Benz E350.
If this is not what fabbrisd had in mind, I look forward to HIS answer to your inquiry.
#1327 of 1986 Re: Got it. Also curious about BMW 5 series vs. E350
Dec 23, 2011 (9:32 am)
Lease or loan will be in my name as will title to car and firm reimburses me. Mike, since you've had a number of BMW's over the years, why did you migrate to the E350 and stay there?