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#4187 of 15392 Mods by stanny1 Aug 09, 2001 (9:17 am)
Wow - so many topics! Going back to the post about the Buick GN and Impala SS and the popularity of the cars, GM really blew it when they closed their Arlington, TX RWD plant and lost all their fun cars. They gave up the police market and the true enthusiast market in one stroke. No wonder their market share is dropping in cars - they are all FWD appliances. In the automotive spectrum, GM is on one end and BMW is on the other. GM engineers must be on Prozac and saltpeter. How frustrating now that bean counters are actually designing cars. Or is it robots! NO PASSION. Yes, the factories are really distant from the 60's when you could order your GTO with the sound deadening deleted for weight saving. Assembly line customization is gone, and that's where the least expensive and best mods can be had. In the press is an article about how Nissan is developing a system that will let you order a car and have it in three weeks if it's a U.S. made model. Probably no aftermarket items but it could be possible in the future. I don't see why manufacturers could not stock, for example, a Borla system that could be factory installed at an additional "option" price. It's been done before. The assembly process is the same as the stock system so I don't think it would be a big deal. To get custom "options" now, we let the dealer choose what's available and their choices are sometimes in poor taste and tremendously overpriced. LM could always publish a "Performance Catalog" like Nissan and others do. My idea of LS aftermarket mods aim squarely at performance. The 2002 LS, especially the V-6, is a rolling admission that first year development time restraints resulted in less than optimum intake and exhaust parameters. So the Borla and intake mods are really recommended. In the case of the Borla, it's actually better than just replacing the mufflers with 2002 models. Borla addressed not only the need for lower restriction mufflers, but increased the pipe diameter, bends, lack of X-box, and finally made the tips chrome and visible. I can't wait to put mine on. Other mods at the top of the list include an LSD pumpkin. What good is power if you can't put it on the ground, especially in slolom type power slides. Right now I'm afraid to power out of sharp hard turns for fear of losing rear traction as one wheel inevitably starts its independent spin. I'm not hot on suspension mods as I can't utilize the handling potential of the car yet, especially without LSD. I'm only interested in wheels if the offset is dialed in for the LS and there is a significant weight savings. An inch wider or larger in diameter does not make IMHO a significant performance improvement for the huge investment required. Finally, I am on a 3 year Red Carpet so I don't want to modify the car so much I can't trade it in for a 2003 or order a 2004 if it has "the right stuff" (praying for VVT, six-speed and LSD). I just need a little more power. Yesterday a 60 year old guy in a newer Avalon tangled with me at a series of stoplights and while I got off the line faster, he was doing better as I went into third. Of course, we were both exceeding the 45 mph limit but it was fun. Too bad there were no corners as part of the run. Oh, I had my 10 and 12 year old sons as ballast and he was alone. That was hurting my power to weight ratio. I think this guy read my license plate frame that reads "Not Your Father's Lincoln" on top and "LS Five Speed Manual" on the bottom and took offense.
#4188 of 15392 value and modifications by thomas_l Aug 09, 2001 (11:19 am)
akirby (4063): It's all in the details - maybe with a few of us the honeymoon is over? Maybe the difference between some that were pumped at first and have had less than desireable experience over time versus the few that found the Car Of Their Dreams in the LS? My apologies for highlighting some negatives lately.   giowa (4062): I think it's just personal preference. Some people just enjoy tinkering and personalizing their cars. It happens that exhaust and intake mods are the easiest to do in many cases. Ditto with the sound system and appearance upgrades. With the lack of mechanical aftermarket stuff, there isn't much more to change outside of totally fabricating your mods.   slunar (4071): Actually I look at ROI. Time + dollars related to actual benefit. I won't waste time or money on something that will pick up 10 hp or add 0.1 G at the skid pad. It's incremental. On the other hand, when the 2.8L V6 in my Fiero sneezes, I will either go with a 3.8L S/C or Northstar. Big time and money investment with a proportional big payback in performance. Using your analogy, many of these minor upgrades are more like sawing an extra hole in the outhouse bench to double it's intake, not moving to indoor plumbing and flush toilets.
#4189 of 15392 Thomas1 -I agree by stanny1 Aug 09, 2001 (11:36 am)
The Borla is probably not "cost effective" but I'll let you know if it and the airbox yields any improvement. That will probably be it, as I have already put in the K&N and Polk DX7's. Unless there is some "magic bullet" coming, I will stop there. Spoilers, wheels, window tinting is not on the menu right now. I would jump on the LSD though.
#4190 of 15392 value/mods/Avalons by brucelinc Aug 09, 2001 (12:59 pm)
At the time I bought my LS, I had considered an A6 2.8, a 528i, a 300M, a Continental(blush)and even a used Seville. After trying them all, I concluded that the LS was a heckuva value - and the best car for me. The competition has gotten tougher but I do not regret my choice one bit.   The minor mods I have done (wud and tires) have enhanced my enjoyment of the car. Lincoln's offer to retrofit the wood wheel and shifter was appreciated. The ability to upgrade the transmission software to the latest version is a huge plus.   Overall, I enjoy the car more now than ever. Having said that, I will be expecting major improvements in the next product cycle. Slunar's outhouse analogy is right on.   Now, I would like to find that 60 year old in the Avalon and show him some LS tail lights.
#4191 of 15392 Stanny by airwolf1000 Aug 09, 2001 (12:59 pm)
Sorry to hear the Avalon was tangling with you. The LS should have with a little more oomph kicked him to the curb. Now regarding those curbs, remember those curbs in the twisties will actually hurt LS unlike the cones;) Just remembering the good old time we all had in January. How about one a parking lot event like the one in LA in Texas? Central to everyone?   Airwolf1000
#4192 of 15392 thomas by akirby Aug 09, 2001 (1:21 pm)
Actually, I thought you had a perfectly reasonable response. You think your C240 is a better value "for you", and that's something that nobody else can argue with.
#4193 of 15392 stanny re bean counting by scottc8 Aug 09, 2001 (3:44 pm)
I agree about GM, except they appear to have hired some 20-something GenX skateboard types, guys who call each other "dude", to do their styling.   As for "cost effective", shoot, we'd all be driving Civics if that was our motivator.   akirby, save that earlier post. May need to Copy/Paste it in here every few weeks.
#4194 of 15392 The True Competition Has Changed That Much (to akirby, #4063) by giowa Aug 09, 2001 (4:29 pm)
Just read the 10/00 issue of Motor Trend, the MY 01 New Car issue. Think you'll see how much what you say is our "true" competion has changed. [However, I also think some AWD and FWD cars are true market competitors with the LS. They have changed, too.]   BMW 3 Series: "Stunning M3 debuts; 2.5L base 6 adds 15 hp; hotter 3.0L upline 6 replaces 2.8L; AWD option on sedan and wagons"   BMW 5 Series: "two new engine choices"   Lexus IS300: Completely new [now with manual tranny for MY 02]   MB C-Class: "Completely redesigned for '01... new chassis, two new engines, a 6M trans for the std C240"   Don't forget about the new 02 Jag X-type. And the 02 Altima shows what is happening at a level beneath the LS.   About the only car that has chanched slower than the LS is the Catera. And look what a non-player it is in the market!
#4195 of 15392 Nice picture, Brian by drolds1 Aug 09, 2001 (6:16 pm)
...but who is this Gowling guy and what has he done with our president:)?   Akirby- you could have left it as "Sentra" To wit: preview of 2002 Sentra Spec V in 9/01 Car & Driver: Available with 6-speed manual, LSD, 215/45ZR-17 Contis, Rockford Fosgate stereo. 0-60 in high 6's, "coners with minmal body roll, is stable in transitional maneuvers, and turns in with real conviction." Estimated base price 17-18K.
#4196 of 15392 Competitors - giowa by akirby Aug 10, 2001 (6:11 am)
I only consider one of the cars you mentioned to be true competitors to the LS and that's the 5-series. The others are much smaller vehicles that don't offer V8s. And don't start whining that their V6 is faster than the LS V8. We all know that the LS needs a power boost and it's coming next year. That's not to say that people won't cross shop those vehicles. Hey, I cross shopped a cougar and mustang before I bought my LS but that doesn't mean they are competitors. Audi A6, MB E-class, BMW 5-series (i don't see where the new V6 engines made that much difference - for $10K more they should be faster), Cadillac Catera/CTS (not much comp. here until they get a bigger engine), Lexus GS (ok, they did get a bigger V8). That's what I consider the competition. And I don't see much that has changed between them in the last two years. If Lincoln can (or will) get the power output in the 300+ range then it can compete with the A6 4.2 and 540i and GS430 in that elite class.   I can understand why some of you who have 2 year leases expiring might be disappointed that no major changes occured for 2002, but think of the position that Lincoln was in in 99. They had no idea if this car would even sell - a totally new car that was totally different from anything else in a new market segment. No business would commit big bucks to a project like that until they're sure they can sell them. I'm sure that's why they're a year behind where they wanted to be. It takes 2-3 years (or more) to make major changes to a vehicle - you can't just do it overnight. I'm also sure that Lincoln has to coordinate major changes with Jag since it's a shared platform. That may have more to do with the engine changes than anything else.   So let's stop whining about the competition and focus on the LS again.

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