Last post on Apr 30, 2012 at 7:10 PM
You are in the Buick Rainier
What is this discussion about?
Chevrolet TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy, Buick Rainier, GMC Envoy XL, Isuzu Ascender, Oldsmobile Bravada, SUV
#17145 of 18329 Re: A/C and fan clutch TSB - where to locate? [deano]
Aug 15, 2005 (7:38 am)
Intermittent Slow to Cool HVAC Performance Concerns in
High Ambient Temperatures and/or High Humidity
Conditions After Start Up, Especially at Low Engine
Speeds (Install New Engine Cooling Fan Clutch)
#04-01-38-019A - (Jun 7, 2005)
Intermittent Slow to Cool HVAC Performance Concerns in High Ambient Temperatures and/or High Humidity Conditions After Start Up, Especially at Low Engine Speeds (Install New Engine Cooling Fan Clutch)
2004-2005 Buick Rainier
2002-2005 Chevrolet TrailBlazer Models
2002-2005 GMC Envoy Models
2002-2004 Oldsmobile Bravada
2005 Saab 9-7X
This bulletin is being revised to provide repair information for this customer concern. Please discard Corporate Bulletin Number 04-01-38-019 (Section 01 -- HVAC).
Some customers may comment on slow to cool Air Conditioning (A/C) performance or high A/C outlet temperatures after start up or that the A/C system is not cooling sufficiently, especially in high ambient temperatures. This may be an intermittent condition and the performance of the Heating, Ventilation and Air Conditioning (HVAC) system may not meet customer expectations.
This condition may be caused by the response of the Electro-Viscous (EV) fan clutch and can be related to airflow across the condenser. This low A/C system performance can occur for longer periods of time if the vehicle is allowed to idle or is driven in low speed conditions. The response of the EV fan clutch will affect A/C system performance. As higher road speeds are attained, the increased airflow across the condenser will usually improve A/C system performance and the response of the EV fan clutch. This condition may be more evident after the vehicle has set for a period of time and can be difficult to duplicate. The condition may occur after the vehicle has set for as little as 10 minutes or as long as overnight. It is most prevalent intermittently during the first 15 minutes of operation.
Technicians are to replace the EV fan clutch with a new design part, P/N 15293048, on vehicles built before June 2005. Vehicles built in June 2005 may already have the updated EV fan clutch and it will not need to be replaced. For 2004 model year vehicles and older, update the Powertrain Control Module (PCM) with a software calibration that was developed to improve coolant temperature gauge readings. This new calibration will cause the PCM to command small amounts of additional fan engagement to better control engine coolant temperatures. Model year 2005 vehicles already have this calibration installed. Refer to Corporate Service Bulletin Number 04-06-02-005 for more information about this calibration. Proper diagnosis of any customer concern is essential. Refer to the Diagnostic Starting Point-Heating, Ventilation and Air Conditioning procedure in SI to begin a diagnosis of any HVAC concerns. Refer to the Diagnostic Starting Point-Engine Cooling procedure in SI to begin a diagnosis of any engine cooling or engine cooling fan concerns. If an attempt is made to diagnose an HVAC system concern, all parameters must be measured. As an example, both the low and high side refrigerant pressure readings must be measured. If only the low side pressure readings were measured, it would appear that the A/C compressor is disengaging at a higher pressure than expected. If both the low and high side pressures were being measured, it would be noted that the A/C compressor is probably disengaging due to the maximum high side pressure cut out point being reached. This occurs to protect the HVAC system from damage. The updated PCM software calibration along with the updated EV fan clutch will improve this condition due to increased air flow across the condenser. The new EV fan clutch has an increased minimum operating fan speed and an improved response time. Additional engine cooling fan noise can be expected with the updated PCM software calibrations.
The last area of customer concern is the operation of the HVAC system blower motor. For vehicles equipped with automatic control HVAC systems (RPO CJ2), the blower motor fan speed will be limited to 80% of maximum when the HVAC system is operating in the automatic mode. To obtain maximum blower motor speed, instruct the customer to manually adjust the blower motor speed to the highest setting.
Part Number 15293048
Description Clutch Assembly
#17146 of 18329 Re: Fan Clutch question... [blink3]
Aug 16, 2005 (9:56 am)
Have an '02 Envoy and here in the Texas heat, interstate driving, the gauge is usually just a tick under 200 (reading 190), now I am noticing that the gauge is climbing 2-3 ticks over 200 while sitting at a light. Maybe I have never noticed it before but I dont remember it ever getting but just a tiny bit over the 200 mark in traffic or sitting at a light. Could this be a sign of the infamous fan clutch going?
Has your engine gotten very loud? When our fan clutch needed to be replaced, the engine in our Envoy XL got very, very loud. It was a roaring noise that got louder with higher RPMs. That was a year or two ago, now that I know about the TSB for the fan clutch it might be worth it to tell the dealer that the A/C isn't cooling well at low or idol speeds to see if I can get the new replacement part.
Aug 16, 2005 (11:39 am)
here on this thread it really seems like a loosing battle when comparing this car to a honda pilot.
I just would like to know if these cars are dependable and if anyone would suggest puchasing this truck over a Pilot?
#17148 of 18329 Re: with all of the complaints [exalteddragon1]
Aug 16, 2005 (1:50 pm)
I have had my 2002 Envoy SLT 4X4 since July of 2001. Have had a few minor issues but overall love the truck. It pulls my 5000# boat/trailer great and has the room and style I need, while getting better MPG than the Yukon. The Pilot is not in the same league with respect to towing, features or appearance, in my opinion. I am certain the Pilot is a fine vehicle, but it's not for me. I want a vehicle that I like to look at every time I get in or out of it. The Pilot is beyond plain and boring in its appearance. If something happened to my Envoy I would go out and get a new Envoy Denali or the new SAAB version tomorrow. I admit that I have been fortunate, but these boards tend to be more heavily popluated by those with complaints than those without. That does not mean the general public has had the same experience.
#17149 of 18329 Re: with all of the complaints [exalteddragon1]
Aug 16, 2005 (3:02 pm)
Folks only come here to complain. More TB's and Envoys sold than Pilots, so you are dealing with a numbers issue here. I had an '03 Envoy and really liked it, liked it so much I bought an '05 Envoy Denali last month. Really great vehicles.
My wife has a Honda Odyssey van, and I for the life of me can't see why so many like that vehicle. Lots of road noise, doesn't drive any better than other vans. JMHO
#17150 of 18329 folks only come here to complain....
Aug 16, 2005 (5:47 pm)
"Folks only come here to complain. More TB's and Envoys sold than Pilots, so you are dealing with a numbers issue here. I had an '03 Envoy and really liked it, liked it so much I bought an '05 Envoy Denali last month. Really great vehicles. "
Which one is it?
1) there are two types of people who post here, those with complaints about the tripletts and those who work for GM or have family who works for GM .
2) follow your instincts, if it quacks like a duck, it probably is a duck.
3) The complaints were and continue to be real.
Some brands have a reputation for consistent quality, Honda is one of them. GM can make a good vehicle, but there seem to be high number of problematic GM cars out there. Why gamble?
I had a bad 3 year experience with a 2002 TB. Sold it and bought a Mitsubishi Endeavor and have had 7500 miles of problem free driving.
#17151 of 18329 Re: folks only come here to complain.... [ficuss]
Aug 16, 2005 (7:41 pm)
Ficuss has a bad taste in his mouth because he had a problem with his GM TB. He jumps on this forum any chance he can and badmouths the product and company. Even when he has leased a different make he comes back. Interesting he is lauding Honda when he got a Mitsubitchi this time.
I don't work for GM, don't have any family that works or worked for GM. I have had a lot of other makes and models. I chose another Envoy because I liked the handling, ride, features, styling of the '03.
We have a Honda Odyssey in the household. I really don't understand all the excitement about that vehicle. Lots of road noise, so so ride, etc.
Aug 16, 2005 (8:39 pm)
This forum is about the vehicles and not the people who drive them.
#17153 of 18329 Re: folks only come here to complain.... [01_hoe]
Aug 17, 2005 (4:22 am)
I had an 02 Trailblazer LS for 11000 miles. It was bought back by GM. I decided to give GM another chance and bought an 03 Envoy SLE because I loved the triplets platform. I have no problems with it for over 2 years and 50000 miles. In July I traded that Envoy in for an 05 SLT and am even happier with my new truck. We have 5 of these trailblazers/Envoys here at work and no one has any problems with theirs. I'm sure, just like other brands, there are problematic triplets out there. My wife has an 02 Acura 3.2TL and its on transmission #3. Also a month ago they had to replace her entire front left bearing assembly. All cars have issues.
The Pilot and Endeavor cannot be compared to the Envoy... Its a different class of vehicle. I believe if you're considering a Pilot or Endeavor, you might as well consider a minivan. Better gas mileage, and ride. The triplets are true trucks with a body on frame design. I towed a 2000 pound double jetski trailer through VT last year with an MDX and hated life when you threw a hill into the equation.
#17154 of 18329 Re: folks only come here to complain.... [ficuss]
Aug 17, 2005 (4:26 am)
I have no connection of any kind to GM. I buy the vehicles that best suit my family. Love the Envoy. Love the Magnum RT Hemi. Two totally different vehicles, but each fills our needs well. Ficuss had a bad experience. I have appreciated his input over the years. I'm just sorry he didn't have a positive experience as I have had.