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Hyundai Elantra 5-door

4930 messages,  Last post on Feb 19, 2012 at 12:53 PM

You are in the Hyundai Elantra Forum.

What is this discussion about? Hyundai Elantra, Hatchback, Sedan

Messages Page 265 of 494

#2636 of 4930 Re:Re...Re:hp by johhu

Sep 18, 2002 (11:09 am)

A mistake IS a mistake. And I don't feel comfortable with it, period .
‘2555’…It sounds to me that a lot of people see this as a way to get something for nothing, that to me is rather a sad reflection on the way society is going. You bought a good car enjoy it.
Re: Do you think they are doing the these buyers a big favor? If horsepower thing is nothing ,they would not have offered the extended warranties stuff. Yet the offered extended warranties might not mean anything to me and most of the buyers. It’s not transferable, and I am not keeping the car for that long.
Hyundai will also damage it's reputation in some of it’s potential buyers mind because of the horsepower issue if it can not make the simple stories straight. I found the following kind of fishy:

'But power was a big deal inside the company, according to Rex Parker, product planner at HMA from 1996-2000 and now at marketing consultant AutoPacific. Hyundai initially used Mitsubishi engines, "and as a matter of corporate pride, Hyundai came up with horsepower numbers higher than Mitsubishi's," Parker says, even though the engines were alike.'
Hyundai officials did not return phone calls requesting comment on Parker's allegations.
http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2002-09-09-hynudai-horsepower_x.htm

Model
Published HP Actual HP Percent overstated
1999-2000 Sonata 2.5 liter 170 163 4.3%
1999 Accent 1.5 liter 92 88 4.5%
2003 Tiburon 2.0 liter 140 134 4.5%
2001-2002 Santa Fe 2.7 liter 181 173 4.6%
1997 Elantra 1.8 liter 130 124 4.8%
2001 XG300 3.0 liter 192 182 5.5%
1997 Accent 1.5 liter DOHC 105 99 6.1%
2002 Sonata 2.7 liter 181 170 6.5%
2003 Tiburon 2.7 liter 181 170 6.5%
1996 Accent 1.5 liter DOHC 105 98 7.1%
2001-2002 Sonata 2.4 liter 149 138 8.0%
2001-2002 Santa Fe 2.4 liter 149 138 8.0%
1997-1998 Sonata 2.0 liter 137 125 9.6%
Source: Hyundai
http://www.usatoday.com/money/2002-09-10-horsepower.htm
Model year

#2637 of 4930 More HP by goby2000

Sep 18, 2002 (7:30 pm)

I totally disagree with DESG's comments. I still don't understand why some posters would not want to be compensated in some way. I know it's only 5HPs, but what if it was 10 or 15, would they think differently? As IOKANNA said its the "principle of it".
 
BTW I still love my car, but I can't help but feel deceived and there's nothing really I could do at this point.

#2638 of 4930 Re: HP by lokanna

Sep 18, 2002 (8:18 pm)

Agreed. It's not like we want something for nothing. We paid (or in my case at least, am paying) for this vehicle that I believe had a 140hp engine. So WHAT if it's 135 and I feel it's adequate, they SOLD me on 140. I don't try to make a claim that it was the only reason for buying the car, but it was a factor in my decision, and for Hyundai to not offer any type of remedy leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Like goby said about, I still love my car, but I feel let down and constraind, and it's not a feeling I enjoy and unfortunately will be something to consider when I look at purchasing a new vehicle. =(

#2639 of 4930 hp by lngtonge18

Sep 18, 2002 (8:35 pm)

I have to agree with Desg. A company has to draw the line somewhere or risk bleeding all sorts of money. Think about it. Hyundai already offers the longest warranty around, which puts them at risk of losing money to warranty repairs as sales continue to skyrocket. And now the issue of hp misrepresentation comes up. With a million cars being affected, it simply wouldn't make fiscal sense to offer everyone some sort of compensation. By deciding to not offer compensation to those who fall under a certain percentage, they are simply protecting their hides from a huge liability. I mean some people were even suggesting a rebate to all those affected, similar to what Mazda offered to Miata owners. What they don't realize is Mazda only had to cover their butts for a few thousand cars, not 1 million. Do you guys want to see Hyundai go bankrupt?? A lot of good an extended warranty would do you if Hyundai ends up like Daewoo. Hyundai is not large enough yet to handle such a large compensation package. Therefore, it makes sense to offer compensation to only those that have the largest discrepancy. A 5 hp difference is pretty meaningless, but 10-12 hp is a lot more noticeable. At any rate, compensation is usually required when there is a safety hazard or some sort of serious malfunction. Neither of which is the case here. The car is still the same car and performs exactly the same.
 
Desg hit it right on the nose. The people of the US feel they are automatically entitled to some form of compensation the second they are wronged. Everyone always wants something for nothing. It's really quite disgusting. No wonder why we live in the land of lawsuits. Some people are just going way overboard about this whole warranty extension thing. You know darn well they simply want the security of knowing their car will be covered under warranty even longer.
 
p.s. Here's a thought: Ever notice how dealer's cover their butts in newspaper ads by stating that they are not responsible for misprints? You don't expect to hold the dealer responsible for the newspaper's misprint so why do you think Hyundai should be responsible for a miscalculation by someone in engineering or whoever made the mistake? It's the same basic principle. Both are in business to make money, not give it away.

#2640 of 4930 I agree by nippononly

Sep 18, 2002 (8:50 pm)

it would have to be an hp discrepancy of more than 10% to be worth compensation, since this is the threshold where it might actually be noticeable.
 
THE ONLY EXCEPTION should be for cars marketed as sports cars or coupes, in which case I think hp measure is a much more important part of the sales package. So maybe you could make a case for Tiburon owners being compensated similar to the way the Cobra and Miata owners were.

#2641 of 4930 continuation of above by lngtonge18

Sep 18, 2002 (8:59 pm)

Put it this way....If a company paid off every customer for every little mistake they made, where would that company be? Bankrupt! Often times you only get an apology for small mistakes and you accept it. Why is this any different? The fact that Hyundai even came clean publicly is commendable to me and improves my respect for the company. Like I said in another forum, Hyundai could have simply lied and quietly lowered horsepower for all their engines this year, claiming tighter emission regulations. This has been used many times before and the public would have thought nothing of it and Hyundai wouldn't have had to pay out any money. There would have been little chance of anyone taking the older cars to a dyno to check horsepower so their tracks would have been covered. Putting all this into perspective makes their decision seem quite fair and financially sound to me. The rest of you are just looking for a reason to complain. It all goes back to that school age mentality: "Hey, he's got better .... than I do. It's not fair! I should have the same thing."

#2642 of 4930 hp by backy

Sep 18, 2002 (9:13 pm)

Lokanna, it looks to me like HMA took the kind of actions you would expect of NBC: they apologized publically (their President apologized, actually--I don't think I'll ever see the President of NBC holding a press conference to apologize for putting a show on 5 minutes late). And then they republished the hp ratings of their cars to where they should have been all along. (Realize that running a show again, at the right time, is no big deal for NBC, since they do it all the time--it's called "summer reruns".) Plus they offered extra compensation to owners who had the biggest hp discrepancies. (Kind of like NBC offering two episodes of West Wing on the same night, I guess.)
 
If it were a 15 hp difference on a 140 hp car, yes, I would feel differently and look to Hyundai for some sort of compensation. But that's a moot point, because if the discrepancy were 15 hp, I would have qualified for compensation under Hyundai's plan. And their extended warranty offer would be good enough for me.
 
Personally I don't really understand all this uproar about misstated horsepower ratings on Elantras et. al., when HMA has IMO made a much bigger mistake that almost everyone is ignoring. Hyundai has fixed the problem with the driver's seat mounts that caused the driver's seat to move forward too far in the IIHS offset crash test, contributing to the Elantra's "Poor" ranking in that test. But they have fixed the problem only on Elantras sold in Korea--not in North America. And they have not recalled the Elantras with the defective seat mounts. This is not a matter of a few lost horsepower--horsepower we never had to begin with. This is a safety issue. Why aren't more Elantra owners up in arms about this issue? Why haven't they written to HMA about it, as I have done (to Finnbar O'Neil, President of HMA)? In addition, why haven't owners demanded that HMA take action to remedy the air bag deployment problem that also contributed to the poor offset crash test results? Yes, I know Hyundai claims there was no problem with the air bags, it's the same sensors as used in the Sonata and they worked just fine in the tests etc. etc. Sorry, HMA--the air bag deployed late 2 out of 3 times in the IIHS tests--not good odds from where I stand--or sit, actually.

#2644 of 4930 lokanna by lngtonge18

Sep 19, 2002 (5:46 am)

You are using analogies that involve money. Sure, I wouldn't want to lose money due to lies or mistakes. This situation doesn't involve taking money out of your pocket. It's not the same. It's a power rating, nothing more. What about when the Big Three overstated their horsepower figures for years? Do you think my dad's 66 Fairlane GT really makes the advertised 320 horses? Hardly! It makes roughly 280 or so. Was he compensated? No! He was theoretically lied to was he not? He doesn't feel like he should be compensated, so why are you any different? Stores promise things all the time, but often don't follow through on them and do nothing for the customer in compensation. An apology is often enough, so what makes this any different? Obviously, you can't look at this in a business sense. I guess you honestly don't care whether Hyundai goes under or not, since you feel every single person should be compensated which would almost surely cause financial problems.
 
As for my ad analogy, think about it further. In the USA Today article it stated that Korean engineers failed to tell US marketing about the discrepancy in power ratings due to our higher emission regs. So now HMA is being held responsible for a mistake done by the parent company in general and the engineers in particular. It was a miscommunication done by HUMAN BEINGS who are capable of making mistakes. Keep that in mind. Mistakes happen and in the real world you aren't always compensated for them.

#2645 of 4930 HP and Warranty by goby2000

Sep 19, 2002 (5:50 am)

There seems to be way too much brand loyalty here... I don't think Hyundai would have come forward with their "mistake" if the Canadian Gov. had not questioned the accuracy of their numbers. It's been going on for 10 years!!
 
I understand the impact of a company having to compensate that many people. At this point I don't care any more whether or not I get compensated. I deeply believe Hyundai has hurt it's own reputation with many of its current and future customers.
 
FYI for US owners, Hyundai Canada only offers 3yr/60km (38 miles) warranty as a standard. (Like every one else except for Kia -5/100km) So an extra year would have been nice.

Messages Page 265 of 494

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