Last post on Jul 23, 2010 at 4:36 PM
You are in the Pontiac Bonneville
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Pontiac Bonneville, Sedan
#3744 of 4400 check and mate!!!
Jan 21, 2004 (6:05 pm)
when most of us veterans of this board started here with our new 2000 ssei's and bonnevilles we talked of lessor competition. Cars like 300 M's, intrepids, Maximas, and such. Well I just put down a review of the new 300c. 340 hp hemi, rear wheel drive, and a 5 speed auto! Lights out Pontiac, you have demonstrated time after time the lack of commitment needed to be the excitement division... maybe the parts shelf or retread division.. The race is over. Take the underpowered GXP and trash it and start over. You have been smoked. ICEMAN... call thye Chrsyler dealer. Probably only need a 12 hour drive in the Hemi to decide who is on the cutting edge...not PMD!
#3745 of 4400 LOOKING FOR ADVICE
Jan 21, 2004 (7:46 pm)
HEY WHATS UP EVERYBODY? JUST WANTED SOME OPINIONS. SHOULD I TRADE IN MY 91 GP GT AND MY 99 GP GT FOR A 2001 OR 2002 SSEI. 99 GP IS LOADED WITH ALL THE OPTIONS. LOVE THE BOSE STEREO.HOW IS THE STEREO IN THE SSEI?LOOKING FOR A LITTLE BIT BIGGER CAR.(BABYS SURE DO TAKE UP A LOT OF SPACE) WAS LOOKING AT SEVILLE BUT REPAIRS SEEM PRETTY EXPENSIVE. GONNA GET EXTENDED WARRANTY ON ANY CAR I BUY BUT CADDY SEEMS TO BE EXPENSIVE FOR ANY REPAIR.JUST WANTED TO SEE WHAT THE BONNIVELLE PEOPLE HAD TO SAY. LOVE THE LOOK OF THE BONNIVELLE.ANY INFO WOULD BE GREAT. THANX JASON
#3746 of 4400 GXP vs 300C
Jan 22, 2004 (8:35 am)
Can't wait to see that Chrysler. The memories of unreliable electronics memories in Chryslers from years past have kept me away from buying a newer model. It's exciting to see the products that DC is bringing to the market. I drove a Durango Hemi a couple weeks ago and was very impressed. Looking forward to seeing this 300C. I won't be in the market for a car in that price range but it it'll be fun to see and drive - then maybe wait for the preowned deals to surface.
Hammen2 - Thanks for the link. I found several shops in my area so I guess I'll give it a try. Printed out lots of info to read up on first.
#3747 of 4400 300C/Chrysler Reliability
Jan 22, 2004 (7:27 pm)
Pics of the 300C can be found here (Google is your friend):
It's personally not my cup of tea.
I think the price on the Bonneville GXP is too high, unless we see mega incentives. For that $$$ I'd look at a CTS or even a GTO (comparing apples to oranges here
Ken, I agree with you re: past Chrysler reliability. My dad was a Mopar man from the 30's through the 70's, but I had more problems with being stranded by Chrysler products (from a 1981 Omni I used to own when I was a poor starving college student, to a 1995 minivan I rented) that I don't know if I could seriously consider one without having my sanity questioned
#3748 of 4400 300C/Chrysler Styling
Jan 23, 2004 (9:53 am)
BOB,I have to agree with you on this also.
It looks more like a boxed off cheese grater- nothing left to the imagination (IMO)
That said, I did a comparison on MSN between the 300C and the GXP-the GXP is more expensive and the 300C has more HP but to me two things come into play here- style and reliability.
Obviously, if you had bad experiences owning a prior make your going to be inclined to purchase the opposite based on that.
Unfortunately, I'm not in the market myself right now to purchase either car brand new and even if I were I'd probably lean toward what Ken suggested- go with a car 1 or 2 years old ETC.
but if I could buy new, I'd go with a new Bonneville not the Chrysler.
I come from a Chrysler car owning family also-
65 Plymouth Barracuda, 66,67,69 Plymouth Fury 3's,66,69 Chrysler Imperials,- 70 Dodge Coronet(THIS ONE WAS THE BEST- NEVER LEFT HOME WITHOUT THE OLD SCREWDRIVER ON THE FRONT SEAT TO KEEP THE BUTTERFLY OPEN CAUSE THE DARN THING ALWAYS NEEDED HELP TO START!!!!LOL!!!!)
*AND ALL OF OUR CHRYSLERS- ("PLEASE DON'T RAIN!!!!")
Anyone who ever owned a Chrysler from the 60's,70's knows what I mean- that sickening WHINING SOUND from the starter as the car struggled to turn over because of the moisture,humidity etc. UGH!!!!
We owned our share of GM cars also- but I would have to honestly say (again, in my opinion) that the GXP is the better looking vehicle- reliability between both cars is the unknown element right now.
Reliability between GM vs Chrysler- GM wins.
#3749 of 4400 GXP vs. 300C
Jan 23, 2004 (12:11 pm)
I dropped off this board awhile back when it got quiet and nobody was talking about the GXP. Glad to see folks talking about it again now that it is about to start showing up in showrooms. I can’t wait to see and drive one. Pontiac engineering, reliability, and style all push me toward the GXP. I’m a little biased because I have been a Pontiac owner for years, but I have stayed with Pontiac because all my Pontiacs have been reliable, fun to drive, and have served me well. I like fantascp’s characterization of the 300C as a boxed off cheese grater! It also looks like it has the roofline from a Checker Cab. And the squared off and flat instrument panel (as opposed to the rounded and “curved around the driver” panel of the Bonneville) turns me off. To each his own, but I guess I’m just not a fan of all the squared off and “angry”looks that many cars’ interiors and exteriors are gravitating toward. The Bonneville from 2000 on, and now especially the GXP, is especially graceful-looking to me, inside and out. There’s nothing “in-your-face” about it—just grace and elegance, now with some real performance goodies added. I hoped for a tad more horsepower than 275 in the GXP, but if that moves that 3,700 pound car 0-60 in 6.5 or 6.6 as advertised, that’s plenty fast for me. I imagine if I wanted to boost the horsepower of the Northstar, that wouldn’t be hard to do.
I agree with the comments on the Hunter GSP9700 balancer. I had balancing problems on my ’98 Trans Am that several dealers and tire shops could not resolve until I found a shop with the Hunter balancer. That was the solution.
#3750 of 4400 Choices, choices...
Jan 23, 2004 (4:40 pm)
For those who might remember, I had been an import buyer for 20+ years before I bought the '00 SLE. Coincidentally, it was a couple of bad import experiences plus the allure of a 300M that made me even consider domestics. I eventually passed on the Chrysler (spotty electricals and trannies) and circumstances led me to Pontiac. I've been happy for 3+ years
But I have to admit that I've been happy despite a few things and some of these things - like the interior - Pontiac has not improved in the 4 years since they introduced the current Bonneville. So, while I will definitely consider the GXP next year, I will have an honest look at all the competition. Will one of those be the 300M? Maybe - but the large-mouth-bass-cum-subway-vent grille will have to grow on me first.
But stranger things have been known to happen in Chateau Ice...
Jan 23, 2004 (8:09 pm)
GXP is a decent car, but the dash needs fixing and the price needs to drop some. With cars like the TL out there a few grand cheaper, the GXP needs better pricing. Pontiac fixed the cladding and engine woes.
Those who buy it are likely to be quite happy with it, however. Nice mill under the hood.
Jan 23, 2004 (10:38 pm)
are you feeling all right???
#3753 of 4400 Luxury - or elegance - with attitude?
Jan 24, 2004 (3:43 am)
That's kinda how I'd describe the current Bonnie as well, Reg: a decent - but not great - car. For what I paid, decent is fine. As you move up the entry price scale, decent won't cut it - particularly as there always seems to be a competitor out there who is upping the refinement ante.
Guys, don't get me wrong on this: I still love my Bonnie and still rate it as the best 4 door sedan I have owned. It is certainly better than my '92 Mazda 929 but it should be: it's 8 years newer. But the Bonneville is, in many ways, less refined than that 8 year older car - more NVH and less well-designed interior (particularly the dash and the door panels).
But the Bonnie is a more visceral experience - it has gobs of low-end torque courtesy the much-maligned 3.8 (keep in mind that mine is the non s/c version). Case in point: I have a stoplight reference point that I've been using for the past decade or so just to cut loose every once in a while. I occasionally let my cars rip from a standing stop and check my speed when I hit the next intersection (it's a country road and there's rarely any traffic so it's safe...). I don't know the distance because that's not the point - it's a consistent reference point and I just like to let it rip. The 195 hp 929 used to hit 105 km/h at that point - my '95 Camry V6 a little less (somewhere between 100 and 105 IIRC). The Bonnie? 120+ easy. And, what's more, it's easy to control the entire time. That little stunt with the Camry is how it earned the name "The Wanderer" in our household.
But for all of the Bonnie's admirable traits, there are warts: to me, it's primarily that the central dash instrument stack is not up to par. The material used for the dash cover itself are fine but that centre stack! It's primarily those cheap grey plastic Sunfire knobs and radio controls but it's not just that - the stack just lacks a sculpted feel. And the those dash vents - sheesh! I know the car is supposed to be "luxury with attitude" and I don't want the attitude scrapped but I want GM to spend more time getting the "luxury" thing right: it's not just amenities (which the Pontiac has in gobs) and materials (which they have mostly right) but elegance of the design as well. And this is the Achilles heel.
I guess what I'm saying is that I personally would prefer an "elegance with attitude" - that would be a balance that would keep me in a Bonnie. And the GXP is miles closer on that balance - just a little more $ on the interior (and maybe RWD?) and I'll be ordering an '05 GXP.
The TL? Well, it impressed me 3 years ago - but lost out to the Bonnie's more visceral nature and more roomy interior. The '04 TL is a huge improvement and is definitely a competitor - but, while certainly more elegant and a strong performer, it lacks the attitude quotient. But frankly, attitude without cojones is simply delusional.
Long post - my bad.