Last post on Feb 16, 2013 at 11:05 PM
You are in the BMW 5-Series
What is this discussion about?
BMW 5 Series, Sedan
Aug 29, 2003 (9:22 am)
As a Nissan owner I never thought I'd have to argue with a BMW owner that BMW's 6 cylinder is not "underpowered".
Perhaps you are looking at horsepower ratings. But I believe that the 225hp 330ci is every bit as quick as the (supposedly) 280hp G35 coupe.
Nissan and Acura seem to have bolstered their horsepower ratings over the past several years compared to the more modest increases in the BMW lineup. But I can immeditely tell the difference from a 190hp 528i to a 225 hp 530i. It is a bigger jump in real power and performance, in my opinion, than Nissan made taking my 1995 190hp Maxima 5-speed up to a 255 hp 6-speed.
BMW does not need to apologize to anyone for the performance of their 6-cylinders. The Japanese have gone to using Shetland ponies as their horsepower standard, BMW appears to use Clydesdales.
#7322 of 12737 power follow-up
Aug 29, 2003 (11:18 am)
I agree with habitat1, while looking at pure numbers the Japanese models have more powerful engines. But something doesn’t add up. Before buying my 03 530i, I test drove a G35 sedan. I believe the engine is rated at 265 bhp. To be honest the acceleration appeared to about the same as a 530i with a meager 225 bhp. Yes, gearing could have something to do with it but there should still be noticeable difference with an advantage to the G35. I wish that BMW had more power in their inline-6 engines. But the power that is there is put to good use.
Habitat1, I am also an owner of a Nissan Maxima SE (95). Great car. I have 100k miles on the odometer and plan to keep it for a while longer.
#7323 of 12737 BMW Horsepower
Aug 29, 2003 (11:23 am)
I have to agree with habitat1, I had a 160 HP 2000 Civic Si and I can tell you, there seems to be way more than a 30 hp difference from that and my 528i. Both are 5 spds but the main difference is that torque kicks in very early with the I6, both are very smooth, but at higher rpm's, when the I4 starts making torque and horsepower, the I4 gets very loud while the I6 is so smooth and quiet that I have to glance down at the tach to make sure I am in the right gear for gas mileage purposes. BMW's seem to be conservative with their HP and Tq ratings. Is there some penalty that the auto makes per in Germany if they have over a certain HP rating? I know in Japan, they have a limit on how much HP a car can make, so the automakers underestimate what the cars are putting out. A good example of this is the WRX STi that is in japan or the Mitsubishi EvoIV, both produce over 300 HP but they are rates in the 280 range.
Aug 29, 2003 (11:24 am)
Based upon the torque ratings though, the Nissan should easily beat the BMW off the line... 255 ft# vs. 214 ft#... If they are the same weight, the Maxima would win if they have comparable transmissions and drive ratios.
#7325 of 12737 hp limit in Japan
Aug 29, 2003 (11:30 am)
I seem to remember that it is not so much that there is anything from liming the hp, but it is sort of a gentlemen's agreement between the manufacturers. Much like the 155 mph speed limit in Germany.
#7326 of 12737 BMW vs. Nissan
Aug 29, 2003 (12:01 pm)
I believe that BMW engines performed between that Nissans/Acuras mostly due to a rear-drive configuration. I remember some car magazines using "German horses are bigger" cliché. Now more and more manufacturers switch to read-drive and BMW advantage is going to disappear. For G35 vs. 330ci CARSTATS.COM shows 5.5/14.2 vs. 6.1/14.7. 330 may feel as quick as G35 but numbers say opposite. BTW I am also a former Nissan owner (98 Maxima SE) and I at that time I did consider 528s to be a slower cars. Not only because they were/are under-powered but mostly because they are usually driven slow drivers (would get 540 otherwise). I drove 530ia and 330ia several and was not impressed at all. Very smooth power-train but no real punch.
Aug 29, 2003 (12:16 pm)
I know exactly what you mean about the HP difference between BMW and a Civic. I have a 99 Si (just sold it) with the 160. If I run my Civic at 90 mph, the engine is running like a sewing machine on steroids and everything is REALLY busy. Even my 325 with it's lower HP rating of (I think) 174, just feels much more composed, smooth, and relaxed.
As long as my car can cruise at highway speeds and handle a quick acceleration to pass going 70+ mph, I'm happy. My Civic Si, while a fun car, never just had that get up and go when it was already at highway speeds. My BMW doesn't have that problem.
I enjoy both cars, but for different reasons. If I were into the HP game, I'd be looking for a Viper or a McLaren.
Aug 29, 2003 (12:24 pm)
Since there are many models of 3 series, 325, 330 and 330ZHP, lets use the 3 series with the Performance Package(ZHP) for reference. You can get the PP for about the same price as a 330i.
As reported in Car and Driver:
0 to 60 5.6 and 1/4 mile in 14.3.
Almost the same considering the huge disparity in HP and TQ. Additionally the ZHP has a revised suspension that the mags seem to go gaga over.
#7329 of 12737 HP Ratings of Japanese cars
Aug 29, 2003 (1:42 pm)
are pure BS and theoretical. There's no way an Acura TL, non type S has the same HP -- or is even in the same league -- as a 330. And this is even accounting for the higher RPMS said HP is measured at on the TL.
#7330 of 12737 Purchased 03 525 instead of 00 528
Aug 30, 2003 (12:52 am)
Purchased a Titanium Silver Metallic with Gray Seats with Performance Package, Sports Package, Steptronic and Fold Down Rear Seats for $37855 + $45 doc fee + taxes at Allison BMW, in Mountain View, CA. MSRP was $44,425.
The owner of the 00 528 I was trying to work out a deal did not accept my offer of $27000.