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Audi A4 2004 and earlier
6042 messages, Last post on Sep 20, 2011 at 4:33 PM
You are in the Audi A4 Forum.What is this discussion about? Audi A4, Sedan
#3259 of 6042 Short reply II by markcincinnati
Feb 18, 2002 (2:48 pm)
I have had two A6 4.2's one of them I have now, a 2001 A6 4.2 sport. I have test driven several A6 2.7T's -- one of them extensively and it had the 6spd manual. The 4.2 feels more solid and even though I know the 2.7T is quicker, the differences are not that great.Based on what I think I know now, I will probably end up with an '03 middle model A6 with a manual transmission -- rumors are wild, but include a 295HP 2.9T engine, a 3.7 V8, the new W8 from the soon to be here Passat -- but this model will probably soldier on at least another year or two with a stick shift unless or until the CVT has been proven in quattro and with the kind of torque the new audi engines will offer -- frankly a 2.9T would be quite satisfactory I'll wager (with the 6spd manual).
The 4.2 feels better -- in every way -- to me than my 1997 A8 (which I kept for 47,000 miles and had special ordered the S8 factory suspension and plus sized tires). I previously (before the A8) had a 1995 S6 which, until my current A6 4.2, was the best Audi I ever owned -- it had the power and the fun transmission -- but I got rid of it, too, right before 50,000 miles.
My wife and I have had two dozen Audi cars (almost all models they have ever offered in the US) since 1978 (my first was a 1978 Audi 5000 followed by a 1979 Audi Fox GTI). We have had a (healthy) love affair with Audi (plus we also had a VW Jetta and a VW quantum and a BMW 325ix [1988] and an American Eagle). As you can tell, we love the VW/Audi brand and all-wheel-drive since virtually all of our cars, except the VW's have been AWD).
We have been to the Audi factory in Ingolstadt 6 times, once as Audi's guest. From time to time we correspond with Audi of America folks about the product and have been to the Audi driving school in Seefeld Austria 4 times 1997 - 1998, 2000 - 2001. Audi test marketed the A8 to 25 customers, in 1996, and we were one of the "lucky" families who got to have not one but two A8's "loaned to us" (a 4.2 quattro and a 3.7 FWD version) as part of the roll out of the Audi A8 in the US.
Audi has rewarded our outspoken loyalty time and again, most recently with a trip to St. Moritz to watchs the women's super G down hill skiing. We are members of the quattro club of America and my wife's photographs of driving schools have graced the pages of the quattro quarterly. My wife is "on" her second TT and will be ordering a 2003 version as the lease on her 2001 225HP TT coupe is up later this year (30 month lease).
We got to drive the A4 quattro sport 2.5TD on a private course in Austria in January 2001 (it still has not made it to the US). This version of the A4 is the best A4 I have ever driven (next to the S4 anyway -- and I suspect it is quicker than the 3.0 -- at least to 80 or 100 kph at least).
So we have much experience, much passion and strong opinions on the Audi brand. And, we love to talk and write about it with our fellow Audi owners and possible future Audi owners.
I like the new A4 a lot and am anxious to see/drive a new body style S4 (hurry hurry AoA).
So much new Audi product is "in the pipeline" -- the next few years look VERY exciting indeed.
Another short reply!?!
#3260 of 6042 WOW! by jdbtensai
Feb 18, 2002 (3:41 pm)
you are audi guy. haven't seen "markcincinnati" on audi world. name there?i am very curious about the upcoming audi cars and engines. from what i know they have a large variety of engines in europe. i'm hoping that the next s4 is the 2.9t, unless the 4.2 is actually lighter.
it would be nice to keep the quattro and yet not let the weight get too out of control.
#3261 of 6042 Claims by markcincinnati
Feb 18, 2002 (4:18 pm)
Nothing happens until it happens -- huh? Which is my way of saying that the Audi people give a nod and wink (in January 2002 while I was in Munich with the quattro Club of America) to the S4 coming out with a 340HP version of the 4.2 -- to battle the BMW M3. However, therefore, notwithstanding, there IS a Cosworth developed 2.9T (bi-turbo, like the 2.7T) engine that must ultimately go into something -- I had hoped for a mild and a wild S4 -- even the mild one would blow away the last gen S4, don't you think?The allroad gets the 4.2 soon, too -- this 4.2 may just be "the little engine that could" -- it too has been created and updated recently as a 4.2T (see AudiWorld, speaking of that web site) in an A6 body to boot (the RS6). W engines, too are coming -- W8 W12 even a possible W10 diesel version. More torque, horsepower, less pollution, greater economy, longer service intervals, etc.
The best really is yet to come: allroad 2 or something like that, a nod and wink to the Steppenwolf, and more S-line cars (coming soon a limited edition S-line TT -- not hotter engine, in this version, just more sporty goodies and a notch or two more upscale.
A 2.0T with 245HP when configured in the S3 or the new '03 TT -- and how about an S3 in this market? An S3 quattro only makes sense in a world where VW Audi (claiming they don't compete for customers -- and pigs fly right?) is bringing out a W8 Passat for $37,900 and a W12 Phaeton with active suspension for $71K -- an S3 will not compete with a GTI eh?
Seriously, I think we may see all these cars, plus some other goodies with some great features and functions.
Gotta go for now!
#3262 of 6042 hmmm? by jdbtensai
Feb 18, 2002 (4:31 pm)
i'd be surprised to see so many varieties of similar cars in america, but it's possible.i'd be surprised to see two versions of an s car, like the s4. that would be like bmw having two m3's, with two different engines. and i'm not counting the v8 racing m3 they have.
if they can mass produce the 4.2 to the extent that it looks like they will i would think that the costs would be fairly low.
any idea what the hp/torque numbers of the 2.9t are?
if they're gonna use the 4.2 so much, then what's the point of the 2.9t?
#3263 of 6042 2.9T and market space by markcincinnati
Feb 18, 2002 (8:35 pm)
While I want an S4 with a 2.9T engine, I must say that all indications and rumors support the notion of a 4.2 non turbo S4. Audi wants a win -- the 2.9T with a reported (in a car magazine, and who knows its accuracy) 295HP (probably so that it doesn't equal the "base" 4.2) would be a great engine.You know, for the US market at least, an A4 with the 2.0T followed perhaps by a 2.9T and a 4.2 in the S4 may make some "marketing" sense. The whole A4 line, then, would be at least 200HP, as the 2.0T can be configured, like the 1.8T was (is) in so many ways.
I have seen the European market accept what, to us in the US might seem to be incremental differences in engines, and engines in cars that we might find hard to conceive -- a 2.8 in an A8 for instance, and a 225HP 1.8T in an S3. And "full size" A6's with 1.8T engines when they were rated at 150HP. Perhaps if our gasoline prices climb above $4.00 a gallon, such differences will not seem minor.
So, Audi will have in its lineup -- in a given body/chassis -- at least two engines and often 3 (based on history at least). Who's to say that the excellent and powerful Audi turbo diesels will not be sent here again.
And, with VW coming out with the W8 Passat, the Phaeton and other more upscale offerings that to me seem competitive with Audi, I can only assume that we will have more and more choices in the near future.
A Phaeton at $71,000 hmmm will that steal from the A8's or from Mercedes and BMW -- time will tell. A Passat with most Audi-like lux trimmings and a 275HP W8 for $10,000 less than an A6 2.7T -- with AWD, ESP, leather and and and. Maybe the idea is the VW corporation grows in total revenue, and "who cares" if the revenue is from Audi, Seat, VW or one of the really high buck car lines?
There are VW golfs and Audi A3's on the other side of the ocean living in harmony. The arguments I have read for years stated that Audi did not compete with VW -- the Audi customer would not be a VW customer, a VW customer would graduate to Audi, etc. VW claims the new cars are aimed at Mercedes target market (with similar features for 20% less).
I keep coming back to my friends who are interested in capability and content, not just image -- they WILL look at VW's and Audis and buy the car that offers the most capability and content for the money.
Today, it is still reasonable and plausible to believe that the discerning buyer can distinguish between the VW and Audi brands -- how about when VW has cars that "list" in the high $30k range to $70K+? Perhaps Audi will just keep going up market in content, capability and (price) class.
I do say, the more the merrier -- but I also wonder if there will be a blurring of the cars in the consumer's mind. Then I would have to say that Audi customers will find VW's of higher content for the money -- or of difficult to quantify differences for the money.
#3264 of 6042 good thing you keep your posts short :) by jdbtensai
Feb 18, 2002 (10:28 pm)
i just hope that the prices don't move up too far. of the audis.i would love to get another s4 in a few years when the new one comes out. but if passes over $50k, then the m3 starts looking REAL nice.
i would definitely rather see the 2.9t in it. unless the 4.2 is actually lighter and cheaper (do to volume of production).
i don't think our gas prices will be moving to european levels for quite awhile. which makes it more surprising that there aren't more "performance" sedans, and sports cars, here than in europe.
#3266 of 6042 Gas Gauge Update by nyccarguy
Feb 19, 2002 (8:50 am)
My friend (I swear it isn't me) who has the A4 3.0 Quattro and the broken gas gauge has brought his car into get fixed again. Hopefully the new instrument cluster (2nd new one besides the one from the factory & new on that broke upon installation) will do the trick.His loaner is an A6 3.0 Quattro. He says the ride is much different (less sporty) than his A4. He says it is much roomier and smoother.
He saw an A4 Cabriolet imported from A of A to do some prelimenary testing and focus groups I guess. He says the Cabroilet is gorgeous. It has a different interior than the A4 Sedans.
I believe the largest Audi dealer on the East Coast (Maybe the largest in the country) is New Country Audi in Greenwich, CT.
Hmmmmmm...An A4 2.0 T with at least 200hp. It is looking better and better than a 325Ci now for when car shopping time comes around in November/December for me.
#3267 of 6042 Disclaimer by markcincinnati
Feb 19, 2002 (11:17 am)
No one, from Audi, who "knows" will actually tell what they know about future models -- unless the information and production are at the point of no return.Yes, there really are 2.0T and 2.9T engines -- but as far as I know, they have been only by rumor and spy photo and dealer inquiries (by Audi, as in ". . .hey dealer, would a 2.0T engine offered in an A4 be a "good thing" for sales?") in any way "announced." One web site I know (and this has been "confirmed" by an Audi salesperson -- who is not actually an AoA employee of course) is showcasing -- they even have a picture -- an Audi TT coupe 2003 model "mule" which has a 2.0T 245HP engine in it. The 2.0T has been written about as yet another can-do engine for the VW/Audi group (probably Audi first). The 2.0T engine will allow Audi to further up the hp and torque in the cars that currently have the 1.8T engine. Since this engine is now widely used in several VW's (Audi's parent company, BTW), it does probably have much more traction than most rumors and predictions from the automotive press.
I am, because I am enthusiastic and optimistic, "suggesting" such future model/engine designations. I am 99% certain of the 4.2 allroad -- and several Audi people have "confirmed" such a car is coming "next." But, 99% certain is not 100% certain.
My point is, if TODAY I was in the market for a new (Audi) car -- I would shop and configure the one that I wanted from the population of known -- for certain -- cars, engines and options. What if the '03 A4, in the US, comes with an uprated 1.8T (upped perhaps to match the TT and VW configuration -- 180HP or MAYBE even 225HP as in the "hot TT," up from the current rated 170HP) and you waited hoping for a 200HP 2.0T because you took comments, speculation and SOME facts from various and sundry web sites and Internet town halls? What if the 2.0T is only available in Europe for a year, etc etc etc?
Please know that all of us ardent (rabid, perhaps) car fans -- especially Audi fans -- do not have a lock on what will happen at the 100% level of certainty.
Now, me, I'm waiting for an S4 or an S6, 'cause I'm certain (99%) they're coming!
Again, I am OFTEN WRONG, but NEVER UNCERTAIN.
Be guided accordingly.
#3268 of 6042 mark by jdbtensai
Feb 19, 2002 (1:02 pm)
i agree with you in thinking that the rs4(will there be one) and rs6 will not make it to the u.s. while the s4 and s6 certainly will.question for you. have you heard anything about power numbers available from the 2.9t?
do you know anything about how the weight of the 2.9t, including the turbos, compares to the weight of the 4.2?
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