Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 5:55 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
#8591 of 24726 Pivoting Headlights
Mar 14, 2005 (10:24 pm)
Mercedes, Lexus and BMW all introduced them for Model year 2004, on the E-Class, RX330 and 5-Series respectively. This was in the U.S. market.
The RX330 came to market first in the spring of 2003 so that is why everyone says Lexus had them first. They were first to actually to put in buyers hands in the U.S. At the same time the technology was present on European Es and 5s, and arrived in the fall of 2003 as MY2004 Es and 5s. In short they all had it at the same time for the 2004 model year.
#8592 of 24726 Re: brand differentiation [ljflx]
Mar 14, 2005 (10:31 pm)
"I think of Chrysler as benefitting from better German engineering (not sure if that is really true or not) and you can see some MB design elements clearly in many of the new styles. I hardly think of them as being branded as one company and I can't imagine many ever will, at least in the near-term (next 10 years)."
Exactly. Also Chrysler has benifited from MB engineering in a many ways. Their biggest hit right now, the 300 uses pleny of Benz know how and hardware. I know that may seem to be a joke on this board, but MB's suspension, transmission and other hard points aren't the cause of their reliability problems. Chyrsler now has a durable 5-speed tranny that can take anything the Hemi can dish out consider this is the same group that engineers trannies for some of if not the highest torque output of any automatic cars around.
"Likewise I think anyone who thinks of Lexus and Toyota as one brand is equally foolish. It's really a silly argument, and one not worth discussing, on both sides.
"In the case of MB though it is far out because they acquired Chrysler. Why penalize a company's prestige for buying another one? Makes no sense. To a lesser extent - but still beyond any sensible credibility - you have certain people who love German cars but who can't and probably never will accept (and clearly don't understand) the risk for creating, challenging and rivaling brands that they want to put on a pedastal. Similarly - why deride a brand for it's guts and success and at the same time redefining the rules of how the game is played. For the record and IMO - Merc1 is NOT one of those."
Ok thats three for three, who is using your user ID?!?! Thanks though, I'm not as much of a finattikker as you thought huh...lol! Long as they don't try to share/engineer a common platform I'm ok with this - true.
#8594 of 24726 Re: Pivoting Headlights [merc1]
Mar 15, 2005 (7:52 am)
BMW made their announcement a full year before Lexus. Unless I misunderstand and you are not referring to the adaptive headlights.
#8595 of 24726 Re: Pivoting Headlights [kdshapiro]
Mar 15, 2005 (12:41 pm)
It doesn't really matter who announces what first. A company could announce something 10 years in advance, but if another company comes out with it first, they could rightfully so be called the innovators.
Anyway, I don't think you can say any of the 3 manufacturer's can take credit for being "first" with adaptive lights. All basically introduced them at the same time.
#8596 of 24726 It's not innovative anyway
Mar 15, 2005 (2:07 pm)
They're not much different from an oscillating fan. And the Nobel Prize goes to...
#8597 of 24726 Re: It's not innovative anyway [designman]
Mar 15, 2005 (3:22 pm)
How is it not a innovation? I think it is a innovation but a very very small innovation. It's definately not a innovation on the scale of let's say, Hybrid Synergy Drive, but nonetheless it is a innovation.
#8598 of 24726 Re: It's not innovative anyway [maxhonda99]
Mar 15, 2005 (4:31 pm)
Point taken Max. I can't argue with that. It's just that I tend to think of innovation as breakthroughs, but there are indeed different levels.
#8599 of 24726 Re: It's not innovative anyway [designman]
Mar 15, 2005 (5:17 pm)
A famous person in the automotive area who drives a bus and whom we both know has already dealt with this.
"The golden years are gone - we have reached the 2nd plateau"
#8600 of 24726 Directional Headlights
Mar 15, 2005 (6:21 pm)
The FIRST with turning headlights was the TUCKER in 1948. The center headlight turned with the wheels. I post here this as I believe the TUCKER was a luxury car of it's time.