Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 5:55 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
Aug 25, 2004 (4:10 pm)
"Reliabilty and build quality go hand in hand. In fact, latest reports show that American cars are ahead of European cars when it comes to reliability."
Initial quality and 5 year reliability are fairly far apart. Yes Buick beat BMW and Honda also, but Buick also beat Caddy. I don't remember but, I'm sure someone can look it up, the reliability Caddy is just on the north side of average. OTOH you could say BMW has started introducting a CADRE of new models also, so let's not play this game until the year 2010.
The Americans still haven't gotten it right. We won't be happy until we pay $75 to fill up a Prius, let alone a gas guzzling hemi.
#6690 of 24726 Americans still haven't gotten it right ???
Aug 25, 2004 (6:10 pm)
From Consumer Reports - Audi A4, reliability has been disappointing - Audi A6, below average reliability - BMW 3-series, not recommended reliability has fallen below average - Mercedes C-Class, reliability has fallen below average - Mercedes SLK - below average reliabilty.
Volkwagen Golf - worse than average reliabilty, Volkswagen Jetta - reliability has dropped below average, Volkswagen New Beetle - below average reliabilty.
So pray, do tell, what must the Americans learn from the Germans????
#6691 of 24726 2003 745LI vs. 2004 LS 430 vs. 2005 E320 CDI
Aug 25, 2004 (6:40 pm)
I test drove the 745 Saturday and the 430 yesterday. I'm looking to purchase one of these automobiles by years end may the best manufacturer win.
Benefits of each: 745 fits my personality; the 430 is on top of everyone's list and the E320 CDI...phenomenal gas mileage.
The 745 did not dissapoint: I smiled 4 times during the test drive. I absolutely love the car.
I was disappointed by the Lexus. It is a technological marvel; however, while I was driving I thought to myself, "This car doesn't have a soul!" The nav system put my ML500's to shame. The lighting was fantastic. The back-up mirror was a nice idea but it takes some getting used to. Acceleration is fine if you floor it but handling was terrible. I remember thinking, "I may get this car in a decade or two." Oh yeah, I'm only 34 and I still love to "drive" so the Lexus is not for me at this time.
I'll let you know how the E320 CDI does after I test it.
#6692 of 24726 Re: Americans still haven't gotten it right ??? 
Aug 25, 2004 (6:53 pm)
If you go to consumerreports.org and link over to recommended autos you will see the list. Note: the 3 series has a red-recommended check mark next to it, but Caddy ain't even on the list.
So I'm not sure of what you are saying, except to say Caddy is starting to get into the game. With that I agree. However, it'll take more than one review to say Caddy has triumphed over all.
#6693 of 24726 Getting it right
Aug 25, 2004 (7:35 pm)
I'm not pushing Cadillac but I do believe that German engineering is not what it used to be. Maybe like everybody else in the cut-throat auto manufacturing business they are cutting corners. Also, their driver interfaces as in the BMW iDrive are a joke. A great source of failure is in their electrical systems. Too complicated. Germans cannot tell the difference between a car and a computer anymore. They make wonderful engines but the wiring is crap and the ignition module fails just as you are merging on the highway.
That being said, if I were in the market for a luxury car, my choice would be the Cadillac STS. It has looks and everything else I've always wanted in a car. Sure, it'll have problems but I'll know that GM will be nearby to fix it for me with less hassles than if it were a Mercedes.
Aug 26, 2004 (3:50 am)
Okay I understand, even agree with *SOME* of what your saying. I do think the generic statement Germans are unreliable doesn't hold water. My German vehicle has had one warranty repair in 2.5 years, loose weatherstripping. I just took in it for it's service, the prior service was May 2003.
So I'm not really aboard the all Germans make unreliable vehicles wagon.
Aug 27, 2004 (6:59 am)
That's old news. The only manufacturer that these days doesn't give incentives is Porsche.
Aug 27, 2004 (7:23 am)
I can think of a few others that don't give incentives: Aston-Martin, Ferrari, Lambo, Rolls-Royce, Bentley, Panoz. I'm sure their are a few more, but i'm sure you meant mass market manufacturer's that don't offer incentives.