Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 5:55 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
#6373 of 24726 mbukukanyau
Jul 26, 2004 (10:03 pm)
All of that is pretty much wild speculation on your part about Cadillac. When Cadillac actually builds an SL55 or M5 killer I'll be one of the first to (grudgingly) admit it. Mercedes has no rivals in the current hp war going on in Germany/Europe, at least among the luxury car makers. Cadillac is about 200hp short already compared to Mercedes biggest hi-po offerings.
Nothing will help the LS430's styling. The 2004 facelift made the car look worse to me, especially in the front. It looks like someone just tacked the grille on afterwards. It is as homely a car there ever was that cost so much, imo. The W140 looked better when it was introduced.
Jul 27, 2004 (4:10 am)
Fact is, all of the luxury battleships are struggling in the bathing suit segment. Winner XJ, no contest. Personally, I don't see how anyone can knock the LS and defend the S. The whole MB lineup looks American. At least the LS resembles what a Mercedes is supposed to look like. W140 is a box. Most of today's cars need serious help.
IMO Acura did a great job with the new RL. There's a lot of chatter about the "Bangle" trunk lid. What everyone fails to realize is that it came from Honda first in the mid-90s Accord (I think), then was followed up by Chrysler with Cirrus, Stratus etc, and THEN the Bangle disasters. Personally, I think this look was originally influenced by the pill-box-flat-top haircuts that the basketball players made popular in the early 90s.
"Don't the girls all get prettier at closing time."
Jul 27, 2004 (4:15 am)
We'll just have to agree to disagree there. The current S-Class shames the bloated wannabe W140 S-Class LS430 in styling, imo. That is a no-contest for me. A Mercedes is never supposed to be ungainly or homely looking like the LS. My pick for a styling winner in the segment would be the A8L.
Mercedes' lineup looks "American"? Uh...ok.
Jul 27, 2004 (6:36 am)
I'll pull the opposite on you. I'll bet most critics of an LS430 have never sat behind the wheel of one. I'll also bet that many LS430 buyers have owned MB E or S class cars before. Do I have statistics - no. Just my feeling because its the situation with the people I know and I'd bet it's representative of a large part of the buying group.
Have you truly ever driven an LS430? You said so in some post not too long ago but I never remember reading about any driving experience you had. I know you've said you drove LS400's in the past but the LS430 is a different animal than the LS400, far tighter, better handling with excellent driving dynamics. So if your basis is the LS400 you are far off the mark. I've driven S-class cars pretty often and there is hardly any different feel than an LS430 in my experience.
#6377 of 24726 Re: (6204)Another Example...... [merc1]
Jul 27, 2004 (6:53 am)
I orginally bought the Allante because I didn't fit in the SL of that time. It ended up being a lucky break for me, The Allante was far more comfortable..Had enough trunk space for two sets of clubs with pull carts, had plenty of power, handled well, and was far more beautiful. In addition the sound system was much better, it actually played CD and tapes, The German car didn't play CDs. There was even a pass through the trunk so you could carry your ski's. As I recall you could not even carry you golf clubs in the trunk of the SL with the top down.
I could follow your advice on how to write and re-word this comment to make you happy....but...Nooooooooooo..I don't think so.
#6378 of 24726 Re: (6204)Another Example...... [michael_mattox]
Jul 27, 2004 (7:04 am)
Merc. I neglected to mention that the Allante also came with a 7 year bumper to bumper warrenty..It was probably as flawed as the Mercedes of that period but at least you could own it for awhile withou it costing you an arm and a leg....It was a second car for most who owned it so the inconvience of having to put it in the shop (yes I always got a Cady for a loaner, It was part of the warrenty) was a pain but a bearable one.
Jul 27, 2004 (1:52 pm)
The current S class shames no one. The last S class was one of the worst lookin overweight, blocky cars of that time. You just can't accept it (a little envy) that your lousy german brand is getting clobbered by the premier Japanese car maker who's new models will again redefine the segement as the original did 15 years ago. Your matter of fact opinion from someone who supposedly drives a bottom tier Japanese brand has zero, zilch, credibility on this board. Lexus is capitalizing the most with former Benz owners who ditched them in favor of a tad less stylish cars but oh so much higher in quality and ownership experience.
Audi's aint killin no one that's a serious laugher! Who the hell is buyin Audi's their in virtually last place in market share and reliability, have been for years. The interior design of Audi's are neato and nice but the rest of car is subpar and going with the new MACK truck grill design will no doubt make them a sales success. Not! A big prediction the new RL will surprise everyone in that segment.
#6380 of 24726 Re: merc1 [ljflx]
Jul 27, 2004 (2:31 pm)
I'm not sure about that. Friends have an LS430 can't wait to give the boat back. Their next car...an x500. Take on LS it's a great car to be a passenger in. But some people want to drive cars, some don't even care about the disparity in the JD, CR, WSJ surveys with defects per 100.
Jul 27, 2004 (3:05 pm)
"Anyway...guess what configuration Porsche sells the most of when it comes to 911s? The 911 C4S in tiptronic from!"
Impossible. You have it confused with something else. No way C4S even comes close to C2 sales, ditto for manual vs Tip.
#6382 of 24726 kdshapiro
Jul 27, 2004 (3:48 pm)
And they think an S500 is a drivers car?? Are they kidding. Its a premium lux sedan with a heavy leaning to lux over sport. MB leaned even further to lux in the refresh. If they want sport they need to go to the Maserati based on what I have read or drop $100k on an S55.