Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 5:55 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
Jun 21, 2004 (8:16 pm)
I guess all this gloom and doom is expected on this board, even before the S-Class is officially shown. The car has a terrible interior and exterior, though it is all mucked up for development work. Yep I too can see what the final car will look like through that mess.
Yep, you may have seen too many, but then again the S600 (except for the wheels) looks just like the S430.
Yikes a bunch of dealership people from Acura and Ford say that MB is finished, they of course know what they're talking about wouldn't be biased at all. Acura especially. Mercedes is finished in their eyes yet Acura still doesn't measure up past one car. Makes sense to me.
The group you spoke with should be disqualified immediately from talking about cars if they're still thinking about Audi's unfounded unintended acceleration episode back in what..the 1980s. Dude they're clueless. Audi was found to be not at fault! You're saying this groups sees Lexus as the standard in quality and reliability. Gasp! Nobody disputed that and its been harped on every spring for the last 10 years when the surveys are released. You're right this group aren't enthusiasts, but I'm glad you recognize this. They think Mercedes is living off their past yet their stuck in the past when thinking about Audi. The 7-Series has excellent quality? Yet this is the car that this crowd's bible (Consumer Reports) said was more troublesome than a 1996 LS400 is today in 2004! What a knowledgeable bunch.
Jun 21, 2004 (9:56 pm)
It certainly is a good time to be the "lexusguy". Personally I couldnt be happier to see Lexus finally shrug off the "lets make it look like a '9x S420" approach and let their OWN designers show what they can really do. LF-S and LF-C, gorgeous. The LF-X is nice, but it seems like there are A LOT of FX45 cues in it.
#5436 of 24726 Mercedes E320 4matic VS Lexus LS430
Jun 22, 2004 (12:41 am)
I think I've narrowed my choices down to these two. Both would sticker at about 58,000 or so as I would want them configured.
I like the exterior of the Mercedes better then the Lexus, but the lexus has the edge in interior design . The Mercedes has awd, which will come in handy in the wisconsin winters. I've test driven them both, and found both to be very capable and comfortable...although the Lexus gets my nod for quietness and ride quality.
I keep going back and forth between these two..I could see myself owning either one, for different reasons. The big weight on the Lexus side of the scale is reliability and durabilty.
Anyone else have any thoughts comparing these two?
#5437 of 24726 Re: Mercedes E320 4matic VS Lexus LS430 [scott1 #5436]
Jun 22, 2004 (2:47 am)
I did this comparison and for the room and reliability decided to go with the LS430 just a month ago. I still like the styling on the E but couldn't get over the reliability concerns and living over an hour from the closest Mercedes dealer I did not want to get to know the service folks and spend time over there. Having experienced Lexus service and quality with my '98 GS I just could not find a reason to switch from it.
I have not been disappointed at all with my LS. Just did a short road trip to Madison and it was wonderful. I will put winter tires on mine this fall, like I have with my other RWD cars, and don't expect any concerns with mobility this winter.
Jun 22, 2004 (8:43 am)
The front would be nice if that is a true rendition but it is an artist's wish. The actual spy photos show an awful interior and an exterior rear and profile that mimicks the Maybach. MB's stylists are making generic looking cars lately. ie, the 2006 ML looks like a Acura MDX, the CLK is a Honda Accord Coupe. The only good looking MB is an E-Class model and the AMG version of the CL. Otherwise all style is gone from Mercedes.
Jun 22, 2004 (9:56 am)
What's your opinion of the SL?
merc1 - If you read again you'll see that I posted they thought the 7-series was a bust but that BMW's - in general- were still well made cars. I didn't say that MB was dead or headed for disaster. Falling from the number 1 spot doesn't mean you are going out of business. I was just surprised that the "Trade" opinion of MB is a lot worse than I thought it would be and pretty much in-line with Consumer Reports indexes.
Jun 22, 2004 (12:45 pm)
Beauty is mostly gone from car design, period. And big conservative sedans have seldom been the car designs to set the imagination flying anyhow. We'll have to wait and see how the new S really looks, until then we're both only speculating, but I certainly do not expect the new S to be the worst looking car in its class, nor do I think Lexus will go as stylish as people here wish for with their most critcal models: they'll probably go for innovative designs with niche models, but the LS will stay a good ole brick design.
I am not a big fan of several of Mercsa new designs: the Maybach is a disaster, a vulgar car design. The new SLK looks slightly Pontiac Aztec-ish. The rest of the line-up, howver, while not imaginative is not a bad looking set of cars, arguably in average Mercedes might stil have the better designs out there now that Jaguar has fattened the XJ and Audi has felt compelled to put that horrible new grill into their cars.
As for Lexus, I would not get too excited because they get two showcars out. The SC430 has not aged well at all, it looks very 3 years ago. They will not dare to make the same mistake with their most important cars.
Jun 22, 2004 (1:35 pm)
I dont like the E. (And Im not just saying this as an LS owner). Those pointless brakes are a definite sore point with me, its been proven that they do NOT outperform standard mechanical brakes, and something like my car's ability to stop is not something Im going to trust to german electronics. Plus, $58K for a 215hp V6? Are you kidding me? M-Bs prices are out of control. If you feel you need AWD, wait for the new RL, M35 AWD, and GS300 AWD. All three will outperform and outfeature the E, and undercut it by at least $10 grand.