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High End Luxury Cars

24723 messages,  Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 6:55 PM

You are in the Sedans Forum.

What is this discussion about? Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan



Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.

A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.

Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.

Messages Page 2431 of 2473

#24295 of 24723 Re: New M3 V8 weighs 33lbs less than outgoing I-6 [tagman] by brightness04

Mar 23, 2007 (6:48 pm)

Replying to: tagman (Mar 23, 2007 10:41 am)
Not sure where the "cast iron V8" came from. I was talking about aluminum V8 having lower weight than cast iron I6; perhaps even aluminum I-6 with turbo charger strapped to the top of it. A turbo charger is certainly much more complicated and weighs more than a V6 with bigger bore would have been, if the goal is 306hps.
 
"The 300 HP I6 twin-turbo is one of the best powerplants to grace our shores in generations."
 
The best for BMW, perhaps. Turbo-charged 6 cylinder developing more than 300hp were available nearly a decade a half ago from Toyota (Supra Turbo), Nissan (300Z) and Mitsubushi (3000GT). It's no co-incidence that BMW is sourcing the turbo charger itself from Mitsubishi. For what it's worth, the 1993 Supra Turbo had 320hp! That's the state of art at Toyota a decade and half ago, if it bothers to play with the turbo charger.
 
So, don't jump to conclusions by stating that this M3 V8 engine will be the mainstream 3-series engine any time soon.
 
I take it that you are preparing to defend yourself in the future by emphasizing "_this M3_ V8 engine" as opposed to just any other V8 engine finding its way into regular 3 series
 
BTW, just to reinterate, my point was that, if the inline configuration is limiting BMW to 3 liters for practical packaging reasonss, the I-6's is an evolutionary dead end. To keep 3 series competitive in the future, BMW will have to bring in the V8 unless it joins the club and make V6.

#24296 of 24723 Re: New M3 V8 weighs 33lbs less than outgoing I-6 [lexusguy] by brightness04

Mar 23, 2007 (6:52 pm)

Replying to: lexusguy (Mar 23, 2007 1:48 pm)
Like I said before, turbo is a make-do measure when the company doesn't feel like spending more money on researching and developing a new and more powerful engine block. Hopefully BMW at least did the plumbing right, and this overheating thing is not a common phenomenom when driven enthusiasticly.

#24297 of 24723 Re: New M3 V8 weighs 33lbs less than outgoing I-6 [brightness04] by tagman

Mar 23, 2007 (7:35 pm)

Replying to: brightness04 (Mar 23, 2007 6:48 pm)
BTW, today's horsepower ratings are generally more conservative as well as subject to regulatory rating standards that were not in place back then.
 
I'm not trying to disqualify your statements, just making some clarification when we are slinging HP numbers around.
 
TagMan

#24298 of 24723 Re: New M3 V8 weighs 33lbs less than outgoing I-6 [lexusguy] by tagman

Mar 23, 2007 (9:29 pm)

Replying to: lexusguy (Mar 23, 2007 1:48 pm)
You know, I really want to test this twin-turbo engine for myself. It continues to get so much praise heaped on top of even more praise... the reviews are terrific.
 
Wow... such an incredible engine... and to think that it's only an I6.
 
TagMan

#24299 of 24723 Re: New M3 V8 weighs 33lbs less than outgoing I-6 [tagman] by houdini1

Mar 24, 2007 (6:18 am)

Replying to: tagman (Mar 23, 2007 9:29 pm)
Apparently an incredibly bad engine. It was throughly trounced by the Infinity G37 in a recent Edmunds test. The 335I overheated and had to retire from the competition. Even when they could keep it running the BMW was beaten badly in the turns. Not as "sporty" as the Infinity.
 
When you take your test drive be careful that you don't get stranded!

#24300 of 24723 Re: New M3 V8 weighs 33lbs less than outgoing I-6 [tagman] by brightness04

Mar 24, 2007 (7:23 am)

Replying to: tagman (Mar 23, 2007 7:35 pm)
I see what you are trying to insinuate, and that would be very wrong. HP has been defined for well over a cetury. The exact testing method for engines used in cars get refined by various industrial associations from time to time on an on-going basis, as usual. The fluctuation has not been huge since the 1970's. Much of the advertised HP numbers for the early 90's turbo engines had a lot to do with drive train ability to put power to the ground, marketting and gentlemen's agreements in Japan. There were quite a few Mitsubishi 3000GT VR4 that had more than 400+hp, some of which I witnessed first-hand on dynometers.

#24301 of 24723 Re: New M3 V8 weighs 33lbs less than outgoing I-6 [houdini1] by tagman

Mar 24, 2007 (8:14 am)

Replying to: houdini1 (Mar 24, 2007 6:18 am)
Apparently an incredibly bad engine.
 
Do you really believe that? Or are you milking the Edmunds situation for all its worth?
 
The reason I ask, is whether or not you want to be on record as saying that the twin-turbo I6 is a bad engine... or not.
 
TagMan

#24302 of 24723 Re: New M3 V8 weighs 33lbs less than outgoing I-6 [brightness04] by tagman

Mar 24, 2007 (8:22 am)

Replying to: brightness04 (Mar 24, 2007 7:23 am)
I see what you are trying to insinuate, and that would be very wrong.
 
You actually believe it is wrong of me to remind you that today's HP numbers have an updated standard for measurement compared to decades ago? You should check the facts first.
 
In addition, I mentioned that any HP differences were not worthy of argument anyway, only for clarification.
 
Sorry you misunderstood my post.
 
TagMan

#24303 of 24723 Re: New M3 V8 weighs 33lbs less than outgoing I-6 [brightness04] by tagman

Mar 24, 2007 (8:25 am)

Replying to: brightness04 (Mar 23, 2007 6:52 pm)
turbo is a make-do measure when the company doesn't feel like spending more money on researching and developing a new and more powerful engine block.
 
Gee, I'll let Porsche know that you disapprove of the 911 Turbo, and that they should have spent more money on researching a better engine block.
 
Give it a break. Yikes!
 
TagMan

#24304 of 24723 Re: New M3 V8 weighs 33lbs less than outgoing I-6 [tagman] by houdini1

Mar 24, 2007 (10:58 am)

Replying to: tagman (Mar 24, 2007 8:14 am)
Do you really believe that? Or are you milking the Edmunds situation for all its worth?
 
Milking? Oh, you mean in the same way you carried on about the
brakes on the pre production LS 460 and what a dangerous situation that was? I would think complete engine failure would be somewhat more serious and certainly just as dangerous.
 
By the way, you kept wanting a definitive answer on the LS brakes. Since the very positive answer was posted I haven't heard a peep out of you on the subject.

Messages Page 2431 of 2473

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