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Sedans High End Luxury Cars
24700 messages, Last post on Dec 01, 2009 at 12:24 PM
You are in the Sedans Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
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Replying to: drfill (Jan 26, 2007 6:08 am) your liveliness does perk up the atmosphere here in the very same way that 60 Minutes improved the liveliness of creative news reporting with that "Audi Unintended Acceleration Story" during the 1980s. The fact that you would even bring up this two decades old BOGUS REPORT from 60 Minutes shows just how distorted an image you have of Audi. This report was unsubstantiated back when Roger Moore played James Bond and Ronald Reagan resided in the White House. I guess it must be very hard to find dirt about Audi when you have to look at such old archived new stories to prove your point. The reality is that in our globalized world today Audi is superior to Lexus not only in terms of their products but also in terms of their sales. With or without dated bogus unintended acceleration reports  When the new A8 arrives expect many raised eyebrows and long waiting lists at Audi dealerships. |
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We have come to the conclusion that Dr.Fill can still cause such a rift among the peaceful and usually cordial posters on this thread. So let's try as we might and put this Audi V. The World thing to rest. To err is human..... That bonehead Audi exec started this. I just pointed out how particularly wrong he was, so shooting the messenger does you no good. As far as this Audi thing goes, I don't see it happening. The A3 is no big deal (rather get a MazdaSpeed3). The Q7 has fallen on it's face. And the R8 looks like roadkill. But the A5 at least will have a stick. So, Audi keeps fighting. Reminds me of a famous quote from my youth: "A Bundy never wins, but a Bundy never quits. No....isn't it a Bundy never learns? No, it's a Bundy never cares. No! It's a Bundy never dies....." When it comes to Lexus, Audi should remain silent. I only stopped by to set it straight. Those who live in glass houses...... I forgive you.  DrFill
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Missed the point again, eh? The point is, that "image" is not "mine". It is Audi's. If I remember it, and I didn't know what an Audi was before that happened, many others remember it as well. For many in this country, that was our introduction to Audi. Hell of a first impression!  And while Lexus was reinventing the luxury car, building itself a wing at the Player's Mansion, Audi was toiling in self-pity, building utterly forgettable vehicles, locking down 2nd-tier status in this country for all eternity. That's all I'm sayin'. No need to get snooty about it.  DrFill
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Replying to: drfill (Jan 26, 2007 7:32 am) Take off those rose-tinted Lexus glasses of yours and read the following (the truth may hurt but read it anyways): Audi R8 "advanced mechanicals" to be implemented in Lamborghini Gallardo Usually when you talk about new technology and novel innovations in the automotive industry, it is the higher-end model from the higher-end brand name that gets the new stuff first, and then it eventually finds its way among the more common stock. This was true of ABS, airbags, variable valve timing, and so many other goodies that we take for granted nowadays. It seems that things are heading in the reverse direction with the Audi R8 supercar, and the Lamborghini Gallardo. A "trickle-up" effect is set to take place wherein the "advanced mechanicals" from the former may soon find their way into the Italian arms of the latter. I'm not saying that Audi is low end, but you have to admit that Lamborghini is decidedly high end. Some people were concerned that the Audi R8 may cannibalize the sales of the Gallardo. After all, they have the same underpinnings and the same target demographic. The R8 comes with some refreshed suspension components, however, as well as a slightly tweaked engine. With the "sharing" of these new elements, the sisters cars are going to look more and more like twins. That said, the next Gallardo -- set to be reworked next year -- should be in the 550 horsepower range. I'd be happy with either. Audi? Lamborghini? Want to send me one as a "press bonus"? link title
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Replying to: merc1 (Jan 25, 2007 9:16 pm) I understand your point, and you already know I dislike cross-brand sharing. But, that said, the relationship between Audi and VW is already a given. The styling themes between all Audi tiers are quite similar, as are the different "class" cars of Mercedes Benz. Lexus cars are very similar and styling even crosses over into Toyota territory. While I am on record of not liking the styling themes to cross over brand lines, I do believe that the grill similarities between VW and Audi lend a familiarity to the look itself. It simply puts more of it out on the roads and highways. When it first was introduced by Audi, it wasn't all that well received. Now it's grown on folks as it is more familiar. In addition, the rest of the car's styling is different enough between VW and Audi... unlike Toyota and Lexus, for example, which can be very similar in overall execution. So... while cross-brand sharing is not one of my favorite manufacturing procedures, I can see the positive influence here in Audi's favor. Ultimately, of course, sales data will tell us. TagMan |
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Replying to: houdini1 (Jan 25, 2007 10:39 am) What is “common knowledge” is that Porsche is the most profitable car manufacturer of late. It’s cliché at this point. It wasn’t this way in the early 90s when they were in trouble and it didn’t start to get better until 97 with the launch of the Boxster then spiked with Cayenne. The actual disparity between their actual profitability and that of others is not common knowledge, and the financials have nothing to do with knowledge of cars. I wonder how many people with this common knowledge had the wherewithal to invest in Porsche in 97. As of last year their investment returned some 1700%. You have to be an even bigger "sucker" to buy a Porsche than an Audi!! It is common knowledge that buying a 4-year old low-mileage Civic or Camry is the best way to cut one’s expenses on cars. So by your philosophy, spending $65K on an LS is also a sucker’s move, to the tune of at least $50K down the drain which could otherwise be invested “wisely.” With this financial perspective, distinguishing between the vehicles in this thread is splitting hairs. People are willing and able to buy these cars, and some neither care to or need to pinch pennies. This hardly qualifies them as suckers.
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Replying to: tayl0rd (Jan 25, 2007 11:33 am) It seems they miscalculated a little. I say “a little” because it is still deemed a financial success even thought the production run fell a little short of their planned 1500 worldwide but more than the 1000 originally planned. I wonder how the owners feel who paid MSRP. I think the CGT will do OK as a collectible though. The one I’m curious about as a collectible is Veyron.
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Replying to: designman (Jan 26, 2007 10:24 am) Yes, and I wonder how many people know that when the stock first went public in the early/mid 80's it was priced at around $400. a share. A four fold increase in 20+ years. Nothing spectacular.
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Replying to: houdini1 (Jan 26, 2007 11:58 am) a four fold increase in 20 years is impressive indeed for an automotive company. Toyota during Jan 1987 was 2009 Yen and today it lists for 8150 Yen. About a 300 percent return. I have no US$ figures since there were no Toyota ADRs back then. What US$-DM conversion rate did you use to determine that Porsche was $400?
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Replying to: dewey (Jan 26, 2007 1:09 pm) Of what significance is Houdini's beef with Porsche, highlighting the fact that the company is highly profitable. So, what? Me thinks Houdini is just throwing out bait. TagMan |
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