You are here: Forums Sedans High End Luxury Cars

High End Luxury Cars

24700 messages,  Last post on Dec 01, 2009 at 12:24 PM

You are in the Sedans Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens

What is this discussion about? Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan

Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.

A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.

Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.

#21598 of 24700 Re: Tag [tagman] by jcoby Nov 30, 2006 (7:46 pm)
Replying to: tagman (Nov 30, 2006 6:13 pm) I also did not make the "WOULD HAVE" and "SHOULD HAVE" arguments that you alluded to in your rebuttal. These statements were listed on the official IIHS press release itself; that is why Toyota/Lexus has even been mentioned. If the official press release did not mention these "WOULD HAVE" and "SHOULD HAVE" cases, than the casual and incurious reader would not erroneously conclude that Toyota/Lexus makes the most number of unsafe vehicles. Somehow I don't believe that you would have made the same argument if Audi, BMW, or Mercedes would have been included in the "WOULD HAVE" and "SHOULD HAVE" argument - this argument that Toyota/Lexus manufactures more unsafe vehicles than any other manufacturer. If you will spend some time viewing ALL of the crash test ratings for various models of choice, you will find that most of these models perform no better than the Toyota/Lexus models that you are criticizing.   Side note: While I was initially angry at your post, those feelings have subsided. I have been lurking in this forum since September and felt that your posting was too over-the-top to ignore; I simply had to reply. I really just want you and everyone else to apply a bit more intellectual rigor and critical analysis to data that is presented by the media. Overall, the posters in this forum are clearly more mature and intelligent than those in other forums (such as the infamous Autospies), and I would like for it to remain that way and actually improve a notch. In my daily life I often hear people comment on things that they clearly know little about and it just wears me out. Replies to this message: tagman (Nov 30, 2006 7:56 pm) houdini1 (Nov 30, 2006 8:18 pm) jcoby (Nov 30, 2006 8:43 pm)
#21599 of 24700 Re: Tag [dewey] by tagman Nov 30, 2006 (7:51 pm)
Replying to: dewey (Nov 30, 2006 7:37 pm) This is the news report's EXACT words. I didn't write those words. I only posted them. I still believe they put a dent in the almighty TMC.   Toyota Motor Corp., whose vehicles earn top marks for buyer satisfaction, has more models than ANY other automaker ranked at the BOTTOM of a crash-protection study.     Toyota and its LEXUS division accounted for nine of 16 vehicles with "acceptable," "marginal" or "poor" rear- impact protection, lowering their OVERALL rating, the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety said today.   TagMan Replies to this message: dewey (Nov 30, 2006 7:57 pm) tagman (Nov 30, 2006 8:30 pm) jcoby (Nov 30, 2006 8:42 pm) brightness04 (Nov 30, 2006 11:32 pm) jcoby (Nov 30, 2006 8:25 pm)
#21600 of 24700 Re: Tag [syswei] by dewey Nov 30, 2006 (7:53 pm)
Replying to: syswei (Nov 30, 2006 7:45 pm) Toyota Motor Corp., whose vehicles earn top marks for buyer satisfaction, has more models than any other automaker ranked at the bottom of a crash-protection study.   More models overall than any other marque was what I meant.
#21601 of 24700 Re: Tag [jcoby] by tagman Nov 30, 2006 (7:56 pm)
Replying to: jcoby (Nov 30, 2006 7:46 pm) jcoby, OK... Cool. TagMan
#21602 of 24700 Re: Tag [tagman] by dewey Nov 30, 2006 (7:57 pm)
Replying to: tagman (Nov 30, 2006 7:51 pm) First we ourselves are accused as spin masters and now Reuters/Bloomberg or whoever printed that story are also anti-TMC spin masters.   I hope this does not go to the World Court. I declare that I am innocent until proven guilty Replies to this message: tagman (Nov 30, 2006 8:30 pm) jcoby (Nov 30, 2006 8:42 pm) brightness04 (Nov 30, 2006 11:32 pm)
#21603 of 24700 Re: High end Luxury Comparison [shop123] by topspin628 Nov 30, 2006 (7:59 pm)
Replying to: shop123 (Nov 30, 2006 7:26 pm) I know of 2 people who also had to resort to lemon law on the early new 7 series due to electronic issues. I'm surprised that BMW couldn't fix these issues. That said, I think they make an outstanding product. I owned an 01 330i that was great. Cars are so much more reliable today that even if they trail the Lexus in problems per car, that may translate into one trip to the service center vs none for the Lexus. I had to take my 3er in for a sticky gas pedal fix that a TSB was issued for. It was done very quickly and I was back driving with a smile. My LS on the other hand has had 0 issues. Whatever car you decide to go for in the luxury sector, you should be fine on reliability (I think that 7 was really an aberration). In my opinion you should get the one that makes you happiest while driving. While it is great security to know that the Lexus is "bullet proof", that aspect usually won't put a smile on your face while you are driving or when you get into the car. I don't think you could go wrong on the reliability front with any of the cars discussed in this forum-I think even the latest 7 series are OK now. Keep us posted on your decision. Good luck. Replies to this message: shop123 (Nov 30, 2006 8:05 pm) dewey (Nov 30, 2006 8:10 pm) shop123 (Nov 30, 2006 8:15 pm) and 2 more... hpowders (Nov 30, 2006 8:21 pm) shop123 (Nov 30, 2006 8:28 pm) and 4 more...
#21604 of 24700 Re: High end Luxury Comparison [topspin628] by shop123 Nov 30, 2006 (8:05 pm)
Replying to: topspin628 (Nov 30, 2006 7:59 pm) thanks - I feel as if I have to make make a decision that will involve sacrifice somewhere. Either in performance or my wallet.   But, as far as the BMW is concerned it was not a unique situation. I know three other 7 series owners in the same boat. I was even warned before I purchased the beast. I was naive and thought the same as most in this discussion. However, in the long and arduous lemon process, BMW said they could NOT fix the bugs. Hence, I received a refund in lieu of a replacement vehicle. I would advise all to avoid BMW like the plague. Replies to this message: dewey (Nov 30, 2006 8:10 pm) shop123 (Nov 30, 2006 8:15 pm) dewey (Nov 30, 2006 8:17 pm) and 1 more... hpowders (Nov 30, 2006 8:21 pm) shop123 (Nov 30, 2006 8:28 pm) hpowders (Nov 30, 2006 8:30 pm) and 3 more...
#21605 of 24700 those by dhamilton Nov 30, 2006 (8:07 pm)
crash test standards seem to be all over the map. I was reading somewhere that the Ford 500 got a gold rating the first year it came out. The second year the rules changed, and it finished close to the bottom in it's segment.
#21606 of 24700 Re: High end Luxury Comparison [shop123] by dewey Nov 30, 2006 (8:10 pm)
Replying to: shop123 (Nov 30, 2006 8:05 pm) Hence, I received a refund in lieu of a replacement vehicle. I would advise all to avoid BMW like the plague.   Thanks but no thanks. I currently love being afflicted with that pestilence called the BMW plague and wouldn't have it any other way. In fact there are no two cars on this earth that provides the value of my BMW335i or my wife's BMW 5 series Touring. NONE whatsoever. And I intend to replace my 335i with a new generation M5 ( the third best value car on this planet earth).   Replies to this message: shop123 (Nov 30, 2006 8:15 pm) dewey (Nov 30, 2006 8:17 pm) shop123 (Nov 30, 2006 8:18 pm)
#21607 of 24700 Re: Hp [drfill] by hpowders Nov 30, 2006 (8:12 pm)
Replying to: drfill (Nov 30, 2006 7:41 pm) Okay. Thanks for the clarification.

You are here: Forums Sedans High End Luxury Cars