High End Luxury Cars

24698 messages, Last post on Nov 30, 2009 at 1:20 PM

You are in the Sedans Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens

What is this discussion about? Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan

Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.

A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.

Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.

Outline

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#20584 of 24698 Lincoln blows it (again) by lexusguy Oct 30, 2006 (5:39 am)
C&D's short take review of the MKX is now on their website. Their conclusion is completely predictable, its a badge engineered Edge with a $9K price hike. They are marching right into RX350 and MDX territory with this:
#20585 of 24698 Merc by drfill Oct 30, 2006 (6:02 am)
Very interesting. The exterior of the S is severly flawed? The slab-sided, ill-proportioned front to rear LS460/L is some type of design triumph or beauty? That is really hilarious doc. You seem to have butchered the term "slab-sided" to fit the LS. Slab-sided would be the new Chevy Tahoe, which I used to like because it had some style to it's flanks! Don't have to worry about that anymore! Lexus installed a character line front to rear, below the beltline, plus the chrome/surface tension that now adorns the lower doors/rocker panels. The S goes to lower the beltline, as it descends under the hoodline, like a Mitsu Eclipse. I personally hate that! Moving the beltline in an arc like that is needless, and unbefitting of a luxury car. I think Mercedes put those humps in the back to prevent a slab-sided look for the S, which has no surface tension to speak of. LG Maybe I don't know what I'm doin', but I didn't have a 700-ft slalom handy, and I hit it with everything I had in 30 seconds, and it came out fine. The course was small, and the ground wasn't up to raceway standards. But 300HP is still a ton of power, and I didn't need Dramamine afterwards. I am no expert after 30 seconds. All I can say is the engine is strong enough. And it had enough composure, kinda like how an LS430 would act. Composed, if not impressive. DrFill Replies to this message: merc1 (Oct 30, 2006 8:25 am)
#20586 of 24698 The cars would separate even more at high speeds by dhamilton Oct 30, 2006 (6:41 am)
"You say a 30 second test drive doesn't reveal everything or even a lot, and I agree with this, but if the first impressions are that a S550 is a superior car dyanamicly in a tight course staged by Lexus don't you think that would carry over the real-world roads? Japanese cars aren't known for improving their dynamics as speeds increase like German cars are". This was something that hit me as well but I forgot to mention it. I truly believe the gap will increase, as speeds increase. The big Benz was just so buttoned down and tight. That's the German car experience in a nutshell.
#20587 of 24698 Re: Alright, let me come at it from a different way. [drfill] by hpowders Oct 30, 2006 (7:05 am)
Replying to: drfill (Oct 29, 2006 7:24 pm) I know. There's no way you could actually tell. All vehicles you drove seem to be plenty fast enough.
#20588 of 24698 Re: Leave it to Tag to cross the line [drfill] by hpowders Oct 30, 2006 (7:14 am)
Replying to: drfill (Oct 29, 2006 8:07 pm) "The IS is more luxurious." The IS is cramped. The 3 Series is quite a bit roomier. As a matter of fact, I have more room in the driver's seat of a 3 Series than I do in the mid-sized Lexus GS.
#20589 of 24698 Re: Alright, let me come at it from a different way. [merc1] by hpowders Oct 30, 2006 (7:20 am)
Replying to: merc1 (Oct 29, 2006 9:48 pm) "Funny colored woods." Yes. I couldn't get used to the ultra-bright highly lacquered wood on the 2006 GS console. When wood is part of the interior, it shouldn't be almost as distracting as neon lights. I consider the appearance of the wood in the Lexus vehicles I have driven to be "tasteless." BMW does it right. The wood is there but doesn't call attention to itself. Replies to this message: psychdoc (Oct 30, 2006 8:57 am) syswei (Oct 30, 2006 9:13 am) hpowders (Oct 30, 2006 12:31 pm) lexusguy (Oct 30, 2006 12:51 pm) merc1 (Oct 30, 2006 9:40 pm)
#20590 of 24698 Re: Merc [drfill] by merc1 Oct 30, 2006 (8:25 am)
Replying to: drfill (Oct 30, 2006 6:02 am) Well obviously we disagree on the looks of the new LS. While better looking than the previous car for sure, especially in the commercial in which it parks itself, it still doesn't come close to the S-Class or A8 IMO. It is just that, slab sided with nothing to break up the broad, flat expanses of unadorned sheetmetal. The new ES350 is even worse. Unimaginative "styling" at its best. You're right about the wheel arches on the Mercedes, they were added to give the car some flair because they removed the body colored rub strips of the W220. The stylists openly admitted this about the new S. The S especially in AMG trim looks better than any LS ever could. Now you're objecting to what MB does with a beltline but you were content harp about Lexus' insipid designs all this time, but now a beltline bothers you! Too funny. M
#20591 of 24698 Re: Alright, let me come at it from a different way. [hpowders] by psychdoc Oct 30, 2006 (8:57 am)
Replying to: hpowders (Oct 30, 2006 7:20 am) You're kidding, right? "The wood shouldn't call attention to itself?" What do you think it's there for? It's a stylization of an otherwise bland interior. And that applies to any car on which it's present. Lexus does wood better than any other car manufacturer. M-B comes in a close second but BMW wood is "tasteful?" It's appalingly ugly. It would look more at home in a Kia. Face it, BMW has no idea whatsoever how to do an interior. Their efforts are ergonomic nightmares and they reflect about zero planning. They drive a lot better than Lexus' but (GMAFB), "their interiors are nicer???" BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA I don't know what drugs you're on, but you need to share them. Replies to this message: syswei (Oct 30, 2006 9:13 am) hpowders (Oct 30, 2006 12:31 pm) lexusguy (Oct 30, 2006 12:51 pm) merc1 (Oct 30, 2006 9:40 pm)
#20592 of 24698 Re: Alright, let me come at it from a different way. [psychdoc] by syswei Oct 30, 2006 (9:13 am)
Replying to: psychdoc (Oct 30, 2006 8:57 am) Wood is a personal preference. I used to like high-gloss Italian lacquer and put that in my bedroom. I no longer like it and will eventually replace the furniture in favor of a satin type of finish. I would actually prefer a satin finish to the Lexus wood, but it isn't a deal breaker.
#20593 of 24698 more commentary from the LS460L/Phaeton/E55 owner by syswei Oct 30, 2006 (9:31 am)
Again from CL: I just took my neighbor -- who has a BMW 7-series with the Sport package -- out for a drive. We spent around an hour comparing the two cars. He was blown away by the Lexus, how quiet and refined it is, how well all the tech works and how easily it can be accessed by the driver, and by the overall sense of very high quality. He was blown away by the rear seat, and thought the handling of our LS460L was not that bad. His BMW is one great handling sedan, but the penalties in NVH make the Lexus feel "peaceful and soothing" in comparison. His words. He's also a performance freak (my daily driver is an E55, and he's had a series of AMG and M cars) so I was surprised that his opinions followed my own pretty closely. He has also spent a great deal of time driving the new S-Class; he can afford just about any car, and said he'd choose the Lexus over the Benz any day.... The guy is very passionate about cars, and just isn't impressed by the new S-Class. He feels the interior is a copy of the BMW, and he liked the LS interior better than either of the German cars. He liked both the design and the materials in the Lexus.