Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 5:55 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
Oct 18, 2006 (6:11 am)
"So the IS sedan not only outsells the cheaper A4, easily, it also outsells vaunted G35 sedan!"
A quote from the Edmunds review of the 2007 G35. "Last year, Infiniti sold 121,000 vehicles, 55,000 of which wore the G35 badge."
Automotive News used to allow non subscribers to view the sales charts but no longer does so I can't check it. Before they cut off access I looked it up and the G35 was second in sales only to the BMW 3-series. California makes up about half of BMW's sales. The G35 out sells the BMW in the rest of the country.
#20036 of 24726 Re: I'm Hoping... [merc1]
Oct 18, 2006 (7:16 am)
Good to hear. My back will appreciate it.
#20037 of 24726 Re: Lexus Quality Slipping [brightness04]
Oct 18, 2006 (8:25 am)
see. Then your earlier statement of "owning for 13 years" without any problem was just wee bit misleading
I've owned a single BMW323i for 8 years. A great car that had spared me a lot of heartbreak in terms of its low maintenance costs after warranty.
Am I the single happy long-term BMW owner in this universe?
Nope! I know other BMW owners personally and my experience is confirmed by various reliability surveys. Overall BMWs reliability is not stellar but they are certainly not below average.
BTW, with the heavily subsidized lease deals on BMW's nowadays,
BMW or MB does not monopolize the industry for good lease deals or discounts. I can assure you there are plenty of individuals that got great lease/discount deals at various Japanese luxury dealerships.
When the new BMW 7 series will be introduced you are going to have a heck of a time in terms of getting a good lease deal. At intro the days that a 7 series will sit at dealers lots will be very low in fact probably lower than what is currently observed with the new 335i:
The average 335i spends a mere eight days on a dealer's lot before selling, according to the Power Information Network The only rival model that's anywhere close is the Lexus IS 350, which spends an average of 20 days on the lot before selling.
The quote above is from a somewhat positive review of the BMW335i which is linked below:
#20039 of 24726 Re: Vehicle Sales [suvguy2005]
Oct 18, 2006 (8:31 am)
California makes up about half of BMW's sales. The G35 out sells the BMW in the rest of the country.
I've never felt so Californian in my whole life.
Although that still does not qualify me to vote for or against Schwartzenegger.
#20040 of 24726 Re: Lexus Quality Slipping [hpowders]
Oct 18, 2006 (8:31 am)
The warranty is 5yrs or 50k miles . . . that's 3yrs of driving for a lot of people. Warranty only covers parts and labor, not the time wasted or consequences of unexpected service outage. The last part is what makes me balk at purchasing unreliable cars. I don't mind spending some time taking it to the shop at time of my choosing, but sudden service outage is a risk that I can not afford to take. More than half the time when I drive, I'm actually expected at the destination; clients who are paying thousands of dollars for me to be there . . . folks that I can not afford to upset with an unreliable car.
BTW, ever had a light bulb outage on those leased BMW? Besides the hassle of small things like the light bulbs, I had a transmission failure and a Motronic computer failure, both leaving me stranded, when I had my BMW's. That was during a phase of my life when my punctuality was not all that important.
#20041 of 24726 Re: Lexus Quality Slipping [brightness04]
Oct 18, 2006 (8:39 am)
My personal experiences contradict your personal experiences with owning BMWs.
Statistically surveys do not show BMWs as being below average in terms of reliability.
Please refer to Kirstie's recent post. You can alway google and find horror stories about any marque. No marque is perfect in terms of reliability and that is why Lexus is still relentlessly pursuing it.
#20042 of 24726 Re: Lexus Quality Slipping [dewey]
Oct 18, 2006 (8:41 am)
A car model that sells 60k copies a year, even with 59k turning out to be complete lemons, would still have 1k satisfied owners. 1k is much more than "a lot," which is 20 That's the problem with anecdotal positive experience. Bad experience has to be the exception/minority in this day and age for any brand . . . the question is how "exceptional" is it for a particular brand . . . i.e. how many sigma's is the buyer/leaser willing to tolerate.
335i has been on the market for only a few weeks, whereas IS350 has been on the market for a model year. I'm already seeing 328 coupe being offered at very heavily subsidized lease deals.
#20043 of 24726 Re: Merc [merc1]
Oct 18, 2006 (8:43 am)
The S600 has never been beaten by anything, not the Rolls Phantom, BMW 760Li or anything else.
Definitely I cant think of a more worthy car than the new MB S600 in being crowned the benchmark HELM sedan.
#20044 of 24726 Re: Lexus Quality Slipping [brightness04]
Oct 18, 2006 (8:48 am)
You are the only person I know who thinks BMW invented the lease deal
There are some pretty good discount deals on Lexuses. But that does not make Lexus the inventor of good discount deals.
REALITY: Most luxury models especially when they're dated have good lease or discount deals. (BMW or non-BMWs)