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Sedans High End Luxury Cars
24700 messages, Last post on Dec 01, 2009 at 12:24 PM
You are in the Sedans Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
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Replying to: unknown (Oct 16, 2006 5:00 am) Not true, it varies a great deal Doc. The E320 won a comparo when it was first released and various AMG cars have one comparos too. The CLK55 beat the 645Ci and Maser Coupe at C&D and the GL450 just polished off a bunch of new rivals. The S600 has never been beaten by anything, not the Rolls Phantom, BMW 760Li or anything else. So you see Doc your statement about MBs "never" being comparo winners isn't true at all. Not even close to being true. You've got to look at their whole range of car, not just the previous S430, E430, and C-Class losses. Secondly this was not about whether or not "Mercedes" cared about the comparos this was about your use of comparos to prop up Lexus being "better" and choosing to forget about them the next when we talk about any other Lexus other than the LS430. The same is probably true for Lexus. You don't want to be a bottom-feeder, in either case. But what would you rather be good at? I'm sure they don't build cars to please journalists. This is an excuse, a cop out doc. The LS430 isn't built for enthusiasts or journalists, C&D even admitted as much and yet it has still wins more often than not. The SC430 on the other hand is bottom feeder as far as comparos go. The M35/45 has put a nice string together, and can't outsell the beleaugered GS! Careful here doc because when/if it does (it has during certain months) that will make it vastly superior to the GS by your logic because the M already has the comparos on its side while the GS has gone back to lagging the pack again. You're falling on your own sword here Doc. M
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Replying to: dewey (Oct 16, 2006 7:58 am) No the last words on the above paragraph are not there in error. In the past Audi has never tried to out-Bling their more ostentatious and conventional competitors like BMW, MB and Lexus. In fact Audi's understated image is one reason why I think Audis are far more successful overseas. People living beyond our shores are less concerned about image than us North Americans. (MB sold luxury for decades in Europe while every street there is covered with MB taxis). Just imagine what would happen to MB and Lexus sales if every other taxi is a Benz or Lexus in North America? Bingo! M |
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Replying to: dewey (Oct 17, 2006 10:59 am) Audi and Lexus are getting closer to being full lineup providers or plan to, but Acura and Infiniti won't be there for years and years, if they're even planning to do so. M |
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Replying to: hpowders (Oct 17, 2006 3:43 pm) IMO they are. The old LS430's seats were like sitting on a padded park bench, good leather but absolutely no support. M
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Replying to: tagman (Oct 17, 2006 6:32 pm) Don't you just love it when slow sales are called "exclusivity""? M
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Replying to: merc1 (Oct 17, 2006 10:35 pm) That makes the Q45 one of the most exclusive luxury cars in the world. Somebody call Infiniti!
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Audi's sell poor here? And the line is forming for 2 years for these demented, unreliable, unusable, failures of cars? That's interesting that you say that as the A4 is still outselling the IS, the car that was supposed to be the dominator in this class. Cheap prices can't get you out of this one. And now for the facts (through Sep. 2006): G35 Sedan US sales in 2006: 26,802 Audi A/S4 US sales in 2006: 28,167 Lexus IS US sales in 2006: 41,666 BMW 325i/325xi/330i US Sales in 2006: 60,724 So the IS sedan not only outsells the cheaper A4, easily, it also outsells vaunted G35 sedan! Now back to your regularly scheduled postings, soon to be corrected, in the Passionate Pursuit of Perfection.  Source: Autochannel DrFill |
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You're falling on your own sword here Doc. Not really. The GL is excellent! I forgot about that one, but I wasn't counting AMG cars, as that's a very small class to beat for comparison. What are they, in a class of two? The 3.5 in the GS will boost sales enough to stay ahead of the M, even though it's dynamics are more pleasant than fierce. Not sure where I "copped out", but you seem to have made my point for me. The LS430 is the most unlikely of enthusiast's magazine champions, but it's inherent excellence wins out in the end. You seem to be under the impression that I said somewhere that every Lexus is better than every Mercedes, which is an error on your part. Unless you have evidence to the contrary?  DrFill
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Replying to: drfill (Oct 18, 2006 4:40 am) Nope, there are Maseratis, Aston-Martins, Motorsport BMWs, S/RS Audis and R Jaguars to contend with. Now if you're going to say that some comparos count and others don't then.... AMGs are Mercedes too. Not sure where I "copped out", but you seem to have made my point for me. The LS430 is the most unlikely of enthusiast's magazine champions, but it's inherent excellence wins out in the end. No your point hasn't been made, nor did you really have one. You gave an excuse about certain Lexuses not being made for journalists or enthusiast and that being why certain Lexus models never win comparos, like the SC430. I said that this notion is disproven a thousand times over if Lexus' dullest, most boring car (the LS430) can win comparos in the eyes of these very same journalist. The fact that Lexus' dullest car wins while their more exciting ones don't shoots down any point you could have even tried to make about comparos. Like I said before you go back and forth from comparos to sales to make a point, one minute comparos are the most important thing and the next they aren't. Reverting back to how good the car is a change of argument mid-stream doc. M |
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